KHS Teacher Controversy

[Guest Guest]

Good point. A grown man whining about how a 16-year old kid "tricked him" doesn't say much for his judgment and ability to teach.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The atheists, Paul's friends decided to invade the discussion board. Good Job bringing your friends here, Paul. They are probably not from Kearny, you know where people are ignorant and where you live....If they were, they wouldn't be having so much fun!

[Guest Guest]

Good point. A grown man whining about how a 16-year old kid "tricked him" doesn't say much for his judgment and ability to teach.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The point is, Matthew didn't do anything! Paul did it for him! Paul probably had problems when he was a kid and now he has decided to accomplish through his son what he couldn't accomplish before. Praying for you Paul...

[Guest Rob]

Pride is one of the seven deadly sins. Isn't it conceited and prideful for one to think that their religion is correct and above all others?

[Guest Guest_Resident_*]

It's time to start emailing the Kearny Board of Education members to tell them to log onto KOTW and find out what the rest of the world thinks.

Here is the link to the website with the emails.

Kearny Board of Education members emails

[Guest Guest]

If you are from Kearny then by now you have heard a story that has been blown WAY OUT OF PROPORTION.

A student of KHS, one Matthew LaClair has gone to the newspaper stating that a teacher has been forcing his religious views in is history class.

Now I am all for having freedom of speech, but I also believe every subject has a place and time for discussion; and religion in a history class is not that place.

HOWEVER!!!! This 16 year old CHILD, is nothing more than an attention seeking, immature person, who is also been known to "previously garnered attention for protesting Bush administration activities by refusing to stand for the Pledge of Allegiance" (the lippar blog) I will include this website at the end of my rant!

This kid thinks he is so self rightcious and claims he “was requesting an apology and correction of false and anti-scientific statements" (the lippard blog).

If you listen to the audio (which I will also supply the site to) you can clearly hear that Laclair PROVOKED the conversation, and you can hear that the teacher had responded QUITE APPROPRIATELY:

One example being:

Matthew: isn't the whole point of public schools is so that you can separate personal beliefs from teachers and administrators from non religious teachings during school, like school prayer and all that.

teacher: the purpose of public school is to provide free education for people that couldn't afford education. That’s the purpose of public school

Matthew: what would decide what religion should be taught in school, what would decide that?

teacher: no it's not about teaching, my point is it's not about teaching religion, these issues all come up in time, ( tape fades out) things get legislated and we talk in class

the public school shouldn't teach a religion but the scriptures aren't religion they are a foundation of the worlds religion, the world main religion any way.

religion is a set way of doing things

In the conversation above, taken my Matthew Laclair himself, i see no wrong doing by this teacher, i do however see constant and what seems to be "rehearsed" provoking of the topic.

I hope he is reading this right now, because I just have one question for him: What on earth was the need to go to the newspaper? Laclair stated that he had a meeting with the principle, teacher, and the head of the social studies department and at first they did not seem to believe him but then he pulled out the cd's.....which in itself violated this teachers right to privacy.

So again, my question, after laclair proved himself with the cd's why did he not wait for administrative action to take place? There was no need to go to the newspaper, and I think in doing so, this Matthew laclair just proves that he is a 16 year old high school student, and therefore has ALOT to learn before he goes off starting religious wars, and pledge of allegiance protest in the United States of America, a country that has always, and especially since 9/11 shown great pride in our ONE NATION UNDER GOD!!!!

ps: a little side note for everyone reading this who disagrees: stating your views on religion and "forcing your beliefs on someone" is two COMPLELTY DIFFERENT THINGS.

so I would like to say to everyone who agrees or disagrees, we are all here in this nation, in this community together, and my religion is Roman Catholic, so when I say GOD BLESS YOU, I’m not forcing my views, I’m using my faith to wish you health and happiness

GOD BLESS you all

PPS: if this offends anyone then tough, because I AM offended that a wonderful teacher is being persecuted by an unknowledgeable juvenile for merely stating what he believes in. Also that this kid is living in MY COUTNRY where my friends and family have fought to keep our freedom and he turns his back on our president and our flag.

lippard blog: http://lippard.blogspot.com/2006/11/public...-class-you.html

Audio:

http://www.nj.com/cgi-bin/prxy/xmedia/nph-.../classaudio.mp3

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So, its not just that there's preaching in class, but people actually support the idiot president? You force people to pledge allegience to a country that has lost its morality by following christianity? Doesn't anyone get it? WE ARE THE BAD GUYS IN THE WORLD NOW...in large part due to the christian right...you people are so lost and you are leading the rest of us to ruin.

[Guest Rob from DC]

Is this whole town crazy?

[Guest Guest]

I just wanted to say that when I was a high school student, I never saw why there was a divide between Christianity and scientific methods. If anything, the use of my God-given senses and intellect to study all Creation only made this world seem more beautiful and amazing. Later, when we studied Einstein's famous equation E=mc^2, I was immediately reminded of the first passages of Genesis. And I always imagined the Big Bang occuring at the snap of God's fingers.

This is how my own view of the world has formed out of respect for both Christianity and science, and I am always saddened when people use the pulpit as a position of authority to divide us. It seems to me that if anything drives people away from Christianity, it is not science, but those who allow religious pride to draw lines in the sand to define "us" vs "them," a practice many find repugnant.

In this particular case, I do not see a clear either/or LaClaire/Paszkiewicz divide either. I don't see where either party is solely in the right or wrong.

Even though I find many of Mr. Paszkiewicz's ideas to be fatally flawed, some of the best teachers I ever had were wrong on occasion, sometimes fundamentally so, IMHO. What they did that earned my gratitude was challenge me and care for me as a student, despite their flaws.

I firmly believe that evangelical talk of religion should stay out of public schools and be left to the home and church. Historical talk of religion in a historical context is unavoidable and should be done so without judgement and in a manner that fairly represents the world's religions.

Though I feel Paszkiewicz veered into Christian proselytizing, I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, because it seemed like he did so to challenge the students' way of thinking. If I were in the class, I would have disagreed with him and would have enjoyed the chance to voice my arguments as LaClaire did. That said, there are other ways of challenging students, and Paszkiewicz should not have been proselytizing, nor should he do it again. Though I am willing to give further benefit of the doubt to Paszkiewicz when he asks his students if the path the discussion was going in makes anyone uncomfortable, he should have realized that objection to Christian discussion carries a stigma that might make someone afraid to speak up. He shouldn't have put any such student in that position.

Even though I agree with Laclair on many points, I feel that he should have spoken up when Paszkiewicz asked if anyone was uncomfortable with the discussion of Christianity. LaClair does not seem disinclined to do so. Instead, he seemed to further the discussion. Even so, he seems to exhibit curiosity and courage I would not normally expect in a young man his age.

I know nothing beyond the single class recording I heard. I have read about LaClair's previous attempts at resolving the issue and reports on how Paszkiewicz reacted, but I do not feel I know enough about how Paszkiewicz has taught the class over a longer term to put everything in the proper context.

At this point, I really do not see how either party deserves the malice being thrown at them. But I do appreciate some of the more thoughtful responses this issue has generated. It reminds me that not everyone has lost their senses.

[Guest Guest]

What is being done with this "student" for embarrassing his teacher, his school and his town?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It looks like its the rest of the town that's causing the embarassment. Its like Kerny, NJ is the Twilight Zone where everyones view are completely backward. Christians try to take the moral high ground and support the president and the pledge of allegience. The president is WRONG, This country is the only one on the planet that talks about bombs and war in its national anthem rather than virtues of the nation. Why pledge allegience to a country that hasn't really been deserving of said allegience?

[Guest Brian, Las Vegas]

You Americans, you've got this wonderful constitution, I'm jealous.  And it seems to me that you just want to throw it away.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Fear not, Rob. Fortunately for all of us in this country, the Constitution, and the laws that adhere to it, are interpreted and enforced by knowledgable and experienced jurists who know a great deal about both its history and its ramifications, even if they don't always agree on its interpretation. This message board is at once a brilliant and terrible example of the American people's involvement and interest in our governmental system. It's brilliant in that it is a wonderful representation of the freedom of speech and of thought that we enjoy in this country. It's also heartening to see that so many people in this country seem to genuinely care about a constitutional issue such as this. It's unfortunate, though, that people on both sides of the issue only want to spew hatred and vitriol about people that believe differently than themselves.

I could not possibly disagree more with the people who are supporting this teacher. As I have posted before, this is not a matter of opinion. The courts in the U.S. have ruled that this type of behavior is illegal and unacceptable. However, for people to turn this into an attack on any religion, including fundamentalist Christianity, is not only counter-productive, in that it makes those critics seem as irrational and fanatical as those they're attacking, but it makes thoughtful debate about this issue much more difficult. This is an important issue, but name calling and personal attacks aren't helpful. The issue here has nothing to do with the teacher's religious beliefs. This is a legal issue. He proselytized, and in so doing he violated Constitutional standards. Period. Whether he's a Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Atheist or Wiccan is entirely beside the point. I am a Christian and I am as offended by his behavior as any non-Christian who has posted on this board. However, how do you intend to convince people on the other side of an argument that they are mistaken when the first thing you say to them is that their religion is mythology or that they are as intelligent as a 2 year old simply because of their religious beliefs? People who make such statements might be surprised at how their intelligence is viewed by objective people.

In any event, I don't think most people in this country want to throw away the Constitution, which most of us agree is wonderful. There are just widely divergent opinions as to how it should be interpreted. That the Constitution allows and encourages such healthy debate is what makes it so wonderful.

[Guest Guest]

The word 'god' should never be spoken by a teacher in school. Simple as that. And despite what may or may not have happened in the classroom, the responses from people from Kerney, NJ are an embarassment to Kerny and to this country. This is one of those times where you should follow the saying "Better to be quiet and let people think you are an idiot than open your mouth and prove it"

[Guest Guest]

Back in my day someone would have a foot up this young gentlemans ass.

Probably a parent.

Not today.

So Sad.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes...they also outlawed slavery since then too.

[Guest Guest]

The Crusades ended a long time ago, buddy...why don't you join the rest of us in the 21st century?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bush is working on the 9th crusade as we speak...so don't count it over yet

[Guest Guest]

Maybe I can stir this little pot...

Last memorial day and 4th of july, some ass came by my home and planted a little american flag by the curb in my yard......red white and blue? yeah right...those things burned blue and orange

[Guest Guest]

Shutting down this board would suggest fear of a potentially superior external influence to a small backward town.

[jophylj]

First, congratulations from this former New Yorker (now proud to be a Georgian) to KOTW for maintaining this excellent site and providing such an open forum for the expression of opinions. Now then, on to the topic: I find it inconceivable that the school authorities would even consider such mild reactions as consultation with Mr. Paskiewicz or temporary suspension. The man has clearly demonstrated that he is unfit to teach in a public school, period. He has even more clearly demonstrated that he does not understand the Constitution and the sound historical reasons why the Founding Fathers - mostly faithful Christians - deliberately and specifically created a secular government. For him to pretend to teach about the Constitution would be laughable, if it were not so outrageous. Mr. P. is certainly entitled to his religious convictions, but he is not entitled - indeed, he is by law forbidden - to preach them in the public school classroom. Let him preach in his church. And let teachers teach in the schools.

[oneellama]

Dear Folks:

Please be careful. Please be thoughtful. Stick to reason. If there are those who are not open-minded, the one abusive email will be what's cited, not the hundred that were rational and promote good choices. We can use the tool wisely, to promote conversation, or we can descend into blog-by-volume. Note how many views these related forums have seen, and imagine even a hundredth of that in your email in-box. And it's possible things are just getting started.

[Guest srn]

1. You can't talk about religion in a public school. You CAN'T. It's the law. If you want to talk about religion or "saving" people, teach in a catholic school.

2. Anything you say in a class of teenagers should be able to be broadcast on national television. If it can't, then you're doing something wrong.

Everything else is immaterial.

[Guest Steveo]

C'mon people this site is viewed by people from all over the world. Do you really want them to think the people of Kearny are on a witch hunt after a teen-age boy?

With eight lessons worth of audio the courts won't have any trouble deciding whether the teacher was preaching or not. If he was, then he should be fired.

Meanwhile it seems to me that Matthew LaClair is a very courageous young man for standing up for what he believes in. And what he believes in - lets not forget - is the American Constitution.

Abe Lincoln would support LaClair, I support LaClair, and any true patriot who truely believes in what this Great Nation stands for would support Matthew LaClair to.

USA! USA! USA!

[Guest Dave]

This is outrageous! Why this school district continues to employ a teacher who tells a young Moslem girl that she's going to hell and tries to foist his view of religion on non-believing students in a public school is utterly beyond me. Can you imagine if this was a Moslem teacher who told his students that unless they believed in Allah renounced false prophets like Jesus they would go to hell what an uproar there would be? I wonder if the good people of Kearny would be so supportive of the teacher then.

[Guest Ed Darrell]

The atheists, Paul's friends decided to invade the discussion board. Good Job bringing your friends here, Paul. They are probably not from Kearny, you know where people are ignorant and where you live....If they were, they wouldn't be having so much fun!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, I'm not from Kearny. I'm from America, however.

Matt, thanks for your defense of the Constitution, New York's Constitution, and education. Clearly, you've learned much more about U.S. history than your teacher had given you credit for -- I hope he can catch up!

By the way, I'm a Christian. And I'm a teacher -- bring in your tape recorders, especially if it helps you with your notes. And when you do bring it in, ask me specifically about the First Amendment and a teacher's duty to stick to the facts. As me about religious freedom.

U.S. history is glorious and wonderful, unvarnished and unedited. Why anyone would want to turn a history class into a religious meeting is beyond me. Such actions detract from history, and frankly they threaten the foundations of our protections for religious freedom. As Madison noted, people need to know the facts in order to preserve freedom. Preaching during class doesn't help the students.

[Guest Mr. Moral Majority]

The atheists, Paul's friends decided to invade the discussion board. Good Job bringing your friends here, Paul. They are probably not from Kearny, you know where people are ignorant and where you live....If they were, they wouldn't be having so much fun!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

ad hominem

1. attacking an opponent's character rather than answering his argument.

2. appealing to one's prejudices, emotions, or special interests rather than to one's intellect or reason.

[Guest Anon.]

Premeditated entrapment!!!

How about the administration taking action against this traitor, who should be dropped in the center of Iraq, so he don't have to salute our flag, but help burn it with people like himself!!!!!

He should be suspended for having a recording device in the classroom.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Perhaps you legal scholars should revist the term "entrapment", the legality of having recording devices in classrooms and the word "traitor".

There is some serious vitriol on these pages, written by individuals who claim to believe in the fundamental tenants of our country and rest their laurels on their Christian beliefs. Last I checked, the Constitution does mandate separation of Church and State, and as public educational institutions are State-funded this does raise a serious legal problem, freedom of speech or no; however, flag-burning HAS been upheld as as legal and protected under the First Amendment. For the record, the words "Under God" were not included in the Pledge of Allegiance until 1954, and early protests against the pledge were brought by religious groups -- should they be burned for their refusal to support the pledge?

Further, I don't recall Jesus's teachings supporting hate.

[Guest Cogito]

To everyone who is attacking this poor student: Where in your supposedly sacred bibble does it say that you can viscerally attack those who disagree with you? Oh right, thats the entire point - religious nutjobs aren't allowed to be tolerant of unbelievers! This whole story, blown out of proportion as it may be, is not about the kid who called his teacher on some exceptionally egregious breaches of conduct.

To those who agree with this so-called teacher, you can choose to believe whatever you want, but if you want to know why secular Americans, and many of your own brethren are so repulsed by your conception of the role of religion in American life, it boils down to one thing: hypocrisy. It baffles me that you can praise Jesus for his tolerance, while you attack those who stand up against blatant prostytizing by an authority figure who should know the difference between his classroom and his pulpit. It is hypocrisy to defend his right to free speech while making ad hominem attacks against the student who felt he needed to broadcast his teacher's transgressions to the world at large. If you want to know why I can't stand people who claim to be christians it is in the hypocrisy of believing in a god who preaches tolerance while simultaneously displaying so much callous intolerance of those who choose not to believe what you believe. I have read your bibble, and I have found not one smidge of evidence that you who call yourself christians are practicing anything that jesus would approve of. step back, and look at yourselves closely, see if you can reconcile what you are with what you believe yourselves to be, and then get back to me. I won't hold my breath though.

[Guest Dust]

What is being done with this "student" for embarrassing his teacher, his school and his town?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What is being done with the mob in Kearny for embarassing our country?

[Guest Guest]

I'm willing to kick in some money towards a medal.

You wouldn't be embarrassed unless that teacher had done something wrong.  If he had been recorded just teaching history like it's his job to do, then there would be nothing to be embarrassed about.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I suspect the ffrf.org folks will be bestowing an award on this brave young man as a winner of one of their Emperor has no clothes awards... you can go to their website and donate to them...I am going to.

Kudos to matt and his dad.

If the pro teacher posts really reflect on the community --and the community reflects the education they obtained therein--y'all got some serious learnin' to do 'bout what makes this country great-- (HINT: it has nothing to do with God or religion)