Irony

[Guest guest]

I do not know how any Kearny fireman can disagree with Governors," Me First," comment. Here's why; Kearny Fireman Mefirst goes to Trenton to rally against a Governor who wants to change the amount of contributions to the public employee healthcare plans amongst other issues. This is to ensure future stability rather than immediate satisfaction but the Fireman want both and they don't care who pays for it. Raise taxes, take the money from the kids education budget, from the senior citizens, from the working man but give whatever you get to Fireman Mefirst. This issue involves all the people of NJ, not just you. You, Mefirst, are also the ultimate example of Mefirst on the face of the earth. Several months ago you agreed to a contract with the town of Kearny and could have made things equal for everyone. A fair and just decision could have been made. When it came to you getting a few less dollars in your raise and everybody doing good, including the new hires, you said, "NO! ME FIRST," and SOLD OUT 17 MEMBERS OF YOUR OWN DEPARTMENT. That is the truest example of hypocrisy I have ever seen. Some nerve you got. You sell out 17 members of your own department, guys you say have your back and may save your life. Then you have the stones to accuse the Governor of short changing you, calling him every name in the book, when only months before, you did what he has yet to do. YOU SOLD OUT 17 of the same guys you work with everyday. THAT WAS YOUR CHOICE, MeFIRST. You clearly said,"ME FIRST," and followed thru with it. See how the way you treat other people comes back to bite you in the end. You may have given the Governor his ideas by your latest contract negotiations. The Mighty, mighty O-Jays had it right. "They smile in your face and all the while wanna take your place, those backstabbers."

[Guest Guest]

I do not know how any Kearny fireman can disagree with Governors," Me First," comment. Here's why; Kearny Fireman Mefirst goes to Trenton to rally against a Governor who wants to change the amount of contributions to the public employee healthcare plans amongst other issues. This is to ensure future stability rather than immediate satisfaction but the Fireman want both and they don't care who pays for it. Raise taxes, take the money from the kids education budget, from the senior citizens, from the working man but give whatever you get to Fireman Mefirst. This issue involves all the people of NJ, not just you. You, Mefirst, are also the ultimate example of Mefirst on the face of the earth. Several months ago you agreed to a contract with the town of Kearny and could have made things equal for everyone. A fair and just decision could have been made. When it came to you getting a few less dollars in your raise and everybody doing good, including the new hires, you said, "NO! ME FIRST," and SOLD OUT 17 MEMBERS OF YOUR OWN DEPARTMENT. That is the truest example of hypocrisy I have ever seen. Some nerve you got. You sell out 17 members of your own department, guys you say have your back and may save your life. Then you have the stones to accuse the Governor of short changing you, calling him every name in the book, when only months before, you did what he has yet to do. YOU SOLD OUT 17 of the same guys you work with everyday. THAT WAS YOUR CHOICE, MeFIRST. You clearly said,"ME FIRST," and followed thru with it. See how the way you treat other people comes back to bite you in the end. You may have given the Governor his ideas by your latest contract negotiations. The Mighty, mighty O-Jays had it right. "They smile in your face and all the while wanna take your place, those backstabbers."

Keep spreading misinformation jerkoff. Your numbers arent correct(shocking). Everybody gave up something, and all 15 firefighters that were going to be laid off were asked how they wanted the union to go about saving their jobs. They had a hand how they were "SOLD OUT". Id say having to stay in a step freeze for one year as opposed to be on unemployment is a pretty good deal, but thats just me. Keep drinking the governors kool aid, you two are almost the same, put out enough lies people will start to believe them.

Get a life loser.

[Guest jus sayin]

First the rally in Trenton was a response to the huge reduction in manpower through layoffs in both Police and Firefighters in the State, even after contract reductions and givebacks,thus causing a drastic reduction in our ability to adaquately serve the public, and to the Governers use of Legislation to replace fair labor negotiations, and intention to eliminate them all together.

Unlike the general working public Police and Firefighters are prohibited from striking and job actions therefore it is a fact in our professions that contract negotiations take years and cost many thousands of dollars in legal fees as most municipalities find it beneficial to delay the process as long as possible which is why Arbitration is frequently the only route, again more time.

KFD's last contract took over 3 1/2 years.

Now Hizzoner wishes to Legislate our Contracts without negotiations.

Taxation without representation was the impetus of the American revolution, Legislation without negotioation is the same thing, and what makes you think it will end with Public employees?

As far as our Pension, starting with Christie Whitman in the 90's State Government has withdrawn funds and withheld pension payments to the tune 3.5 Billion.

When private companies do this to their employees it is a crime.

How much of your pension did you give to the State to pay it's bills?

Truth is both Police and Fire have stepped up to the plate when asked to help reduce Municipal Debt.

This States financial condition along with the Countrys is a direct result of the games being played on Wall Street, not Public employees, we're just being used as scapegoats.

Now here's two questions for you....

Exactly how were 17 members of the KFD "sold out"? Please be specific, I use facts in my replies I expect the same in return.

How much did you give back in your last Contract so that your fellow employees could retain their jobs?

Now how about for a change you put your brain in gear before you put your fingers in motion.

jus sayin

[Guest Guest]

I do not know how any Kearny fireman can disagree with Governors," Me First," comment. Here's why; Kearny Fireman Mefirst goes to Trenton to rally against a Governor who wants to change the amount of contributions to the public employee healthcare plans amongst other issues. This is to ensure future stability rather than immediate satisfaction but the Fireman want both and they don't care who pays for it. Raise taxes, take the money from the kids education budget, from the senior citizens, from the working man but give whatever you get to Fireman Mefirst. This issue involves all the people of NJ, not just you. You, Mefirst, are also the ultimate example of Mefirst on the face of the earth. Several months ago you agreed to a contract with the town of Kearny and could have made things equal for everyone. A fair and just decision could have been made. When it came to you getting a few less dollars in your raise and everybody doing good, including the new hires, you said, "NO! ME FIRST," and SOLD OUT 17 MEMBERS OF YOUR OWN DEPARTMENT. That is the truest example of hypocrisy I have ever seen. Some nerve you got. You sell out 17 members of your own department, guys you say have your back and may save your life. Then you have the stones to accuse the Governor of short changing you, calling him every name in the book, when only months before, you did what he has yet to do. YOU SOLD OUT 17 of the same guys you work with everyday. THAT WAS YOUR CHOICE, MeFIRST. You clearly said,"ME FIRST," and followed thru with it. See how the way you treat other people comes back to bite you in the end. You may have given the Governor his ideas by your latest contract negotiations. The Mighty, mighty O-Jays had it right. "They smile in your face and all the while wanna take your place, those backstabbers."

Sorry,I can't agree. I'm not police, fire or any state employee. I understand where you are coming from because at one point in my life I was young and starting a new career. I'd like to hear from you when you have put 15, 20, 25, 30 years on a job and expected certain things to be true, like a negoiated contract. The United States of America is not a socialist country. We have the rich, middle class, poor. I get from your post that you are young and just starting out. You have the chance now to get out and do something else if the local fire department is not going to work for you. That's the best thing about the USA. You don't have to depend on our government to do anything for you, you can do it on your own. However, it takes hard work! Too many Americans today think our government owes them something! Not! I know someone on here is going to call me names because they disagreee, but I really tried to give you the other side of the coin, that's all. Life is full of disappointments and sometimes we all have to reassess and go in another direction. Good luck.

[Guest guest]

Thank you for calling me a young man, I haven't heard that in probably in 30 years or more. The three responses to my post were exactly as I figured. You are proud of yourself for being generous enough to give 15 ( I said 17) guys a voice in WHICH WAY they were going to be screwed by you and your gang. What a great guy! You can all stop your flag waving and singing, "God Bless America" now as a smokescreen. I can say with confidence that none of you ever had to fill out a job application in your life until Mommy or Daddy had already gotten a job for you. It was just a formality. A Fireman's job is about as far away as a hard job that anyone can get. It's a political handout. You were probably all marginal students and Mommy and Daddy knew you weren't going anywhere so they went to the local Mayor and got a job for you. How impressive. Your kids probably follow your example and wifey or you will have to beg the Mayor for a job for them to wallow in mediocrity as you are, and I mean job wise, not money. Corzine was your hero because he was a trust fund baby and anyone without $400 million in the bank means nothing to him. He has contributed $0.00 to the Democratic party since getting booted out of office. Before that, he was very generous. He bought the Governors job. Thats what you feel you are entitled to, a future of little or no work for a unjustly large salary. Now you are throwing a childish tantrum when the new guy at the helm says you have to contribute a few dollars more towards your retirement umbrella. You know he's right, but your ego cannot absorb the blow. If you can't make it on what the contract said when you originally signed up for the job you were handed, too bad. Get a 2nd job to cover your lavish lifestyle. That might involve, oh my goodness, doing some actual work. You can't allow that. Nobody in the real world feels sorrow or pity for you, don't you get that. There were almost no people with jobs that require work rallying with you in Trenton. Only poor you. That's just to bad. " ME FIRST."

[Guest Back to Reality]

First the rally in Trenton was a response to the huge reduction in manpower through layoffs in both Police and Firefighters in the State, even after contract reductions and givebacks,thus causing a drastic reduction in our ability to adaquately serve the public, and to the Governers use of Legislation to replace fair labor negotiations, and intention to eliminate them all together.

Unlike the general working public Police and Firefighters are prohibited from striking and job actions therefore it is a fact in our professions that contract negotiations take years and cost many thousands of dollars in legal fees as most municipalities find it beneficial to delay the process as long as possible which is why Arbitration is frequently the only route, again more time.

KFD's last contract took over 3 1/2 years.

Now Hizzoner wishes to Legislate our Contracts without negotiations.

Taxation without representation was the impetus of the American revolution, Legislation without negotioation is the same thing, and what makes you think it will end with Public employees?

As far as our Pension, starting with Christie Whitman in the 90's State Government has withdrawn funds and withheld pension payments to the tune 3.5 Billion.

When private companies do this to their employees it is a crime.

How much of your pension did you give to the State to pay it's bills?

Truth is both Police and Fire have stepped up to the plate when asked to help reduce Municipal Debt.

This States financial condition along with the Countrys is a direct result of the games being played on Wall Street, not Public employees, we're just being used as scapegoats.

Now here's two questions for you....

Exactly how were 17 members of the KFD "sold out"? Please be specific, I use facts in my replies I expect the same in return.

How much did you give back in your last Contract so that your fellow employees could retain their jobs?

Now how about for a change you put your brain in gear before you put your fingers in motion.

jus sayin

I know you don't want to hear this, but here's a cold dose of reality for ya:

1. Only 6,000 showed up at the police and fire rally in Trenton; that was a very sad showing.

2. The residents of New Jersey elect their legislators and the Governor, not you or government employees. The State of New Jersey is not obligated to spend money it does not have. And Government does not pass laws by negotiating with government employees. Yes, government negotiates contracts with its employees but the State pension system and State Health Benefits is set by legislation.

3. The pension fund has a $50+ billion shortfall. There's nothing that will change that except for lowering pension benefits from the amazing 65% of a policeman's or fireman's highest salary after 25 years of work. Plus, a policeman and fireman can start collecting his pension immediately on retirement in their 50's or even 40's if they started working in their 20s. Since the average police and fire salary is 90,000 a year, that's a $60,000 a year pension. The NJ homeowner can't pay for that.

4. Government employees are the only ones left in NJ with a significant pension. Everyone else has shifted to 401K retirement plans where the employee takes the entire risk of saving for retirement. Some of the unions, like building trades, still have pensions but only get 20% of the benefit you get and have to wait until 55 in age to collect. In the private sector, no companies are giving out pensions. Most NJ residents work in the private sector.

5. Arbitration is now capped at 2% a year beginning in 2011. It's now called the "rocket docket" with a 45 day turnaround on all arbitrations filed after January 2011.

6. Government employees should realize they no longer control the democratic process in NJ. The general electorate is fed up with high taxes. For the first time ever, they have a Governor taking up the challenge.

7. Polls released yesterday show that Governor Christie's popularity rate is now up to 58%.

[Guest Guest]

Your attempt at a history lesson leaves much to be desired. Whoopee, I got a job working 80 days a year for $100,000.00 Way out of line. You should get $25,000.00 a year at most. You only compare your contacts to other towns fireman when they should be compared to all citizens jobs. You are no better than anyone else, but your elephant sized EGO and mosquito sized brain can't accet that. Everyone knows what happened in the past. It has been beat to death. The government is not a private company, so no issue there. Wall Street had little to do with Police and Fire contracts. The CDO's they sold burnt evryone because of their own greed. The Governor never said he wanted to do away with unions or collective bargaining which is purposefull inaccurate information by you to gain sympathy. Poor me. I don't have a state pension or contract with any town so I could care less. As to the sold out 15 or 17, the union could have taken a slight pay cut and the new hires would not have to miss a step. 1.5% of your medical is waek, a token proposal that could cost you about $250.00 a year. When you recently took your job (I say that because your childish remarks reek of someone who has never worked a day in his life) the contract you signed said what your salary is, what benefits you get, and what pension you get. They never promised you a raise every year, never said you weren't going to pay partially towards your healthcare, and if you want to stay 50 years, go right ahead, but accept the consequences of the new contracts. Jus Sayin...you are an idiot and nobody in the general public in supporting your greedly little mind. The lack of citizens at your BS rally told you that. If you can't live on what you make, quit and go elsewhere. No sleeping 16 hours at other jobs.

[Guest jus sayin]

Well you managed to write two full paragraphs hurl a few poor attempts at insults and not offer one fact.

Another job poorly done.

I don't remember offering any job comparisons to other FD's so I'm not sure where your going with that comment but if you want to compare apples to marsupials fine.

I choose to compare my job and benefits with that of the CEO of Goldman Sachs, not an ordinary enough citizen? Ok how about your job then, what was it you did for a living again?

I actually do agree with one comment you posted, I have no problem taking what my original contract provided for retirement, no one is looking for more, just for the State to keep it's end of the bargain.

To the one poster that was kind enough to post a well thought out response I'll repeat what I've been saying all along....

Twenty plus years ago when I became a Firefighter if the State had come to me and said "we cannot afford your pension" I would have responded "fine I'll pay all expenses and you are out". No dipping into my piggy bank and helping yourself anymore, I'll sink or swim on my own and so will you.

And like it or not you know damn well the State would never have gone for it, Christie Whitman could not wait to get her hands on our money even as we fought to keep her out.

The pension has been around a long time why only after these political shenanigans is it now unaffordable and unsustainable?

Coincidence?

I have no problem with contributing more to my pension nor for that matter health benefits,but through negotiations not as dictated to me by a politican with "higher aspirations".

So you say Governer Christie has a nice high approval rating.

Really?

So did Adolph Hitler in 1930's Germany when he first decided that the Jewish populace was responsible for Germanys economic crisis.

History sees it another way though doesn't it?

Just because you tell the people what they want to hear and give them a scapegoat to focus their hatred on.

Doesn't make you right, or moral.

In fact you just might be a monster.

jus sayin

[Guest guest]

The person under the title of Back to Reality is a breath of fresh air. Words of wisdom! This pity party has gone on for too long. "We run into burning buildings," "We're always in danger" and "We knock down fires." It's more like "We're always sleeping," "We're always cooking," and "We're always watching TV." Everyone is sick to death of your war stories, but they are even more sick of paying your outrageous salaries and for your Golden Parachutes. Your sorry Mefirst rally in Trenton wasn't for the people. You tried to pass it off like it was, but it was strictly for greed. If your profession was priced right, there would be twice as many Fire houses and a cop on every corner. A lot of nepotism and patronage jobs that I mentioned previously ARE the Firemen. The general public was never under the impression that these jobs, the Fireman at least, were created for public safety. I've been saying it all along, it's a form of welfare being a Fireman. The Cops are sorely needed in NJ and the more Cops on the street the better. If people weren't doing anything wrong, they would never complain about the Cops, but people blame the Cops for everything. The Mefirst Firemen are not asking for MORE cops or fireman on the streets to increase public safety for the citizens. Mefirst fireman only wants more money for "Me First." (himself) The FD's and PD's really did a great job FOR Governor Christie by their own foolish actions. In NJ it was always like a quiet thing about how much the cops and fireman made. Now, after that rally, all you hear people saying is, "MY God, I didn't know they made so much money and those medical plans plus a 65% or 70% pension after only 25 years. It makes me sick." The now older population never had it nearly that good. The next rally you are gonna have will be 5,000 cops and fireman, but also with 20,000 citizens right next to them saying F*** this, they make too much already. Whoever planned that rally is the biggest bunch of boneheads on the face of the earth because now the public is much more AGAINST you. Another thing I said before was that a G.E.D. was not the way to go and teach your kids not to "settle" for a FF job. This rally proved my point with flying colors. Good luck now, you're gonna need it.

[Guest Guest]

Thank you for calling me a young man, I haven't heard that in probably in 30 years or more. The three responses to my post were exactly as I figured. You are proud of yourself for being generous enough to give 15 ( I said 17) guys a voice in WHICH WAY they were going to be screwed by you and your gang. What a great guy! You can all stop your flag waving and singing, "God Bless America" now as a smokescreen. I can say with confidence that none of you ever had to fill out a job application in your life until Mommy or Daddy had already gotten a job for you. It was just a formality. A Fireman's job is about as far away as a hard job that anyone can get. It's a political handout. You were probably all marginal students and Mommy and Daddy knew you weren't going anywhere so they went to the local Mayor and got a job for you. How impressive. Your kids probably follow your example and wifey or you will have to beg the Mayor for a job for them to wallow in mediocrity as you are, and I mean job wise, not money. Corzine was your hero because he was a trust fund baby and anyone without $400 million in the bank means nothing to him. He has contributed $0.00 to the Democratic party since getting booted out of office. Before that, he was very generous. He bought the Governors job. Thats what you feel you are entitled to, a future of little or no work for a unjustly large salary. Now you are throwing a childish tantrum when the new guy at the helm says you have to contribute a few dollars more towards your retirement umbrella. You know he's right, but your ego cannot absorb the blow. If you can't make it on what the contract said when you originally signed up for the job you were handed, too bad. Get a 2nd job to cover your lavish lifestyle. That might involve, oh my goodness, doing some actual work. You can't allow that. Nobody in the real world feels sorrow or pity for you, don't you get that. There were almost no people with jobs that require work rallying with you in Trenton. Only poor you. That's just to bad. " ME FIRST."

Here's Barney pretending to be Joe Citizen, he's a joke.

[Guest Harrison's Bravest]

Your attempt at a history lesson leaves much to be desired. Whoopee, I got a job working 80 days a year for $100,000.00 Way out of line. You should get $25,000.00 a year at most. You only compare your contacts to other towns fireman when they should be compared to all citizens jobs. You are no better than anyone else, but your elephant sized EGO and mosquito sized brain can't accet that. Everyone knows what happened in the past. It has been beat to death. The government is not a private company, so no issue there. Wall Street had little to do with Police and Fire contracts. The CDO's they sold burnt evryone because of their own greed. The Governor never said he wanted to do away with unions or collective bargaining which is purposefull inaccurate information by you to gain sympathy. Poor me. I don't have a state pension or contract with any town so I could care less. As to the sold out 15 or 17, the union could have taken a slight pay cut and the new hires would not have to miss a step. 1.5% of your medical is waek, a token proposal that could cost you about $250.00 a year. When you recently took your job (I say that because your childish remarks reek of someone who has never worked a day in his life) the contract you signed said what your salary is, what benefits you get, and what pension you get. They never promised you a raise every year, never said you weren't going to pay partially towards your healthcare, and if you want to stay 50 years, go right ahead, but accept the consequences of the new contracts. Jus Sayin...you are an idiot and nobody in the general public in supporting your greedly little mind. The lack of citizens at your BS rally told you that. If you can't live on what you make, quit and go elsewhere. No sleeping 16 hours at other jobs.

Poor Barney, crying every day about the professional firefighters that he wishes he could be part of. How sad for someone to be so obsessed with professional firefighters while knowing he could never measure up to their high standards.

Barney and Charlie the Tuna, perfect together.

[Guest Guest]

I know you don't want to hear this, but here's a cold dose of reality for ya:

1. Only 6,000 showed up at the police and fire rally in Trenton; that was a very sad showing.

2. The residents of New Jersey elect their legislators and the Governor, not you or government employees. The State of New Jersey is not obligated to spend money it does not have. And Government does not pass laws by negotiating with government employees. Yes, government negotiates contracts with its employees but the State pension system and State Health Benefits is set by legislation.

3. The pension fund has a $50+ billion shortfall. There's nothing that will change that except for lowering pension benefits from the amazing 65% of a policeman's or fireman's highest salary after 25 years of work. Plus, a policeman and fireman can start collecting his pension immediately on retirement in their 50's or even 40's if they started working in their 20s. Since the average police and fire salary is 90,000 a year, that's a $60,000 a year pension. The NJ homeowner can't pay for that.

4. Government employees are the only ones left in NJ with a significant pension. Everyone else has shifted to 401K retirement plans where the employee takes the entire risk of saving for retirement. Some of the unions, like building trades, still have pensions but only get 20% of the benefit you get and have to wait until 55 in age to collect. In the private sector, no companies are giving out pensions. Most NJ residents work in the private sector.

5. Arbitration is now capped at 2% a year beginning in 2011. It's now called the "rocket docket" with a 45 day turnaround on all arbitrations filed after January 2011.

6. Government employees should realize they no longer control the democratic process in NJ. The general electorate is fed up with high taxes. For the first time ever, they have a Governor taking up the challenge.

7. Polls released yesterday show that Governor Christie's popularity rate is now up to 58%.

Uh now I have to correct another person who is terribly mistaken.

1. 15,000 people showed up not 6,000. http://www.nj.com/po...aders_slam.html

2. Christis approval rating as recently dropped 10 points thank you very much http://www.newjersey...opped-10-points

3. Since you didnt have any facts straight about the average fire salary or the police and fire pension here you go.

New Jersey's Professional's

FIREFIGHTER'S - Physical Facts

"What Governor Christie Doesn't Want You to Know"

1. Life expectancy for Firefighters after retirement is approximately 6 years. (USA Today)

2. Every Fire Department in NJ is currently understaffed, leaving Firefighters and citizens at considerable risk. (NFPA)

3. Firefighting is a young man's profession and one of the "most dangerous and stressful jobs in the United States."

4.. Firefighter's have the longest work week of any public employee (42 hours)

5. Firefighter's work night, weekends, all major holidays, for straight time.

6.. Firefighters are 10 to 100 times more likely to suffer from a heart attack. ( NEJM)

7. Firefighters are 10 to 30 times more likely to suffer from lung disease, cancer, diabetes, blood borne pathogens, flu strains, back, hip and knee injuries, broken bones, hearing loss, loss of taste and sense of smell. (NEJM) "With continued neglect, the fire service will continue to lose countless members to mental and physical fatigue before their time."

http://firechief.com...vice/index.html

8. Firefighters are exposed to and suffer physical, emotional and mental stress from witnessing the following: homelessness, poverty, domestic violence, child abuse, drug abuse, alcoholism, sexual abuse, violent death, suicide and man's general inhumanity to man. (NEJM)

9. Stress from job spills over into home life, causing a higher rate of divorce, approx. 75% nationwide. (Portia Rawles, PSY.D.)

10. Health Benefits ARE a critical component to a firefighter's rehabilitation.

New Jersey's Professional's

FIREFIGHTER'S - Financial Facts

1. Firefighters are not eligible for Social Security upon retirement, as are private sector employees.

2. The average annual salary for Firefighters is $56,000, well below the average mean income.

Most take 7 to 10 years to reach top pay.

http://epi.org/publi...ons/entry/BP270

3. NJ's Firefighter's and Police sustain their own pension system and contribute 8.5% of their salaries, among the highest of any NJ public employee.

4. Firefighter's and Police pensions have been raided (stolen) $3.5 billion year since the Whitman administration (1995 NY Times)

5. Firefighters across the State agreed to millions in freezes and concessions to avert layoffs.

6. Firefighters and Police pensions are sustainable and improving annually.(NJLM, William Dressel)

"Letter to NJ Mayors":http://njfmba.org/bulletin/2011/January%202011%20Web%20Version.pdf (January Bulletin)

Rachel MaddowVideo: www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#40902120

7. NJ State has failed to fund their pension obligations for 8 consecutive years. Governor Christie has yet to make a payment, as is his obligation.

http://www.huffingto...u_b_805050.html

8. Most municipalities have deferred (borrowed) payments into firefighter pension fund.

Edited March 12, 2011 by KOTW
Corrected Link to January 2011 Bulletin.

[Guest Guest]

Thank you for calling me a young man, I haven't heard that in probably in 30 years or more. The three responses to my post were exactly as I figured. You are proud of yourself for being generous enough to give 15 ( I said 17) guys a voice in WHICH WAY they were going to be screwed by you and your gang. What a great guy! You can all stop your flag waving and singing, "God Bless America" now as a smokescreen. I can say with confidence that none of you ever had to fill out a job application in your life until Mommy or Daddy had already gotten a job for you. It was just a formality. A Fireman's job is about as far away as a hard job that anyone can get. It's a political handout. You were probably all marginal students and Mommy and Daddy knew you weren't going anywhere so they went to the local Mayor and got a job for you. How impressive. Your kids probably follow your example and wifey or you will have to beg the Mayor for a job for them to wallow in mediocrity as you are, and I mean job wise, not money. Corzine was your hero because he was a trust fund baby and anyone without $400 million in the bank means nothing to him. He has contributed $0.00 to the Democratic party since getting booted out of office. Before that, he was very generous. He bought the Governors job. Thats what you feel you are entitled to, a future of little or no work for a unjustly large salary. Now you are throwing a childish tantrum when the new guy at the helm says you have to contribute a few dollars more towards your retirement umbrella. You know he's right, but your ego cannot absorb the blow. If you can't make it on what the contract said when you originally signed up for the job you were handed, too bad. Get a 2nd job to cover your lavish lifestyle. That might involve, oh my goodness, doing some actual work. You can't allow that. Nobody in the real world feels sorrow or pity for you, don't you get that. There were almost no people with jobs that require work rallying with you in Trenton. Only poor you. That's just to bad. " ME FIRST."

Yup, your right sorry 15 guys you got to screwed! Instead of collecting unemployment and having all the time to spend on KOTW like the poster who I'm replying to, you got to keep you job! Sorry about that I know how much you were all looking foward to watch what you so hard to become go down the drain because of a lying sack with an agenda because the cops and ffs didnt vote for me that is our governor tried to take from you. Oh and us doing actual work? I've served my country for 10 years and I have 3 part time jobs just to make ends meet so I can afford to pay my mortgage. Shocker huh? That $100,000 salary you all cry that the fire fighters get isnt enough? Oh I know because I dont make $100,000. I'd love to see you who is so critical of the fire fighters in Kearny and Harrison try to crawl down a smoke filled room with heat so hot if you stick your head up you get burned. Or how about come help us cut a family out of a car up on the turnpike at 3 in the morning knowing that atleast one of them isnt going to make it. You people have no clue of what your police and fire do day in and day out. You just sit behind your computer and scream about how we steal from the tax payers. Its a disgrace to any man or woman that has given their all to the community and either die in the line of duty or die from medical complications from a call they were 15-20 years earlier. Keep bashing us but the bottom line is when something bad happens we will still be there, because thats the type of men in women you have working in West Hudson.

[Guest guest]

You lied to everyone just now by saying that the Kearny Fire Department has never compared its contract number$, wording, or healthcare plans without ever looking at another town of similar make up. Do you think the private company employees or even monkeys in the Bronx zoo would believe that? One of you Steven Hawkings even suggested that a task was "out of the scope of a fireman's job description." That proves it's an outright lie. Did that FF author a book of job parameters or scope of a fireman's duty while sitting at home. No, he compared it to other towns FD contracts. How else do you decide if the price tag on your service is comparable of that with others? I think that only in the extreme would some nut case such as a fireman compare his salary to Jon Corzine. If one person works at Wal-mart and another at Target in a similar capacity there is no doubt ones gonna ask the other how much each other makes. It's just curiosity. Why not pay a fireman what Gates or Buffet makes? Demand creates the price, just like buying a home. If everybody made the same, where would the impetus for innovation come from for stem cell research, a cure for cancer, a solution for the country's dependence on fossil fuels, etc...R & D at companies come from. The firehouse? It comes from the price placed on these things by society and entrepeneurship. You are saying that Dr. Jarvik who created the artificial heart should make the same as a fireman? I knew your EGO's were outrageously huge and you think you are the ultimate males on the planet, but the truth is you are just holding a spot for another lumper down the road. A little less EGO, a lot more brains please if possible.

[doc13mets]

OK I think we can all agree the pension thing is a mess.

People are saying that we should basically through the FF's/PO's pensions right out the window, well thats no the solution really either. A lot of these guys are working towards retirement and have a certain expectation in mind. We can just cut them all together. Now if we say we are going to reduce benefits for people in the system that are like 15 years away at least they can start making those adjustments to better prepare for retirement.

Interesting article about the future of state aid and shared services

Could this force Harrison, Kearny and East Newark to merge services such as DPW, FD, PD? If they towns got on the same page and made sure there was no reduction in front line manpower only a reduction in the supervisors we could save a big chunk of change. Also eliminating the Civil Service will allow West Hudson Residents to get some preference and be hired in the FD/PD. Wouldn't that be nice?

[Guest guest]

Thank you for calling me a young man, I haven't heard that in probably in 30 years or more. The three responses to my post were exactly as I figured. You are proud of yourself for being generous enough to give 15 ( I said 17) guys a voice in WHICH WAY they were going to be screwed by you and your gang. What a great guy! You can all stop your flag waving and singing, "God Bless America" now as a smokescreen. I can say with confidence that none of you ever had to fill out a job application in your life until Mommy or Daddy had already gotten a job for you. It was just a formality. A Fireman's job is about as far away as a hard job that anyone can get. It's a political handout. You were probably all marginal students and Mommy and Daddy knew you weren't going anywhere so they went to the local Mayor and got a job for you. How impressive. Your kids probably follow your example and wifey or you will have to beg the Mayor for a job for them to wallow in mediocrity as you are, and I mean job wise, not money. Corzine was your hero because he was a trust fund baby and anyone without $400 million in the bank means nothing to him. He has contributed $0.00 to the Democratic party since getting booted out of office. Before that, he was very generous. He bought the Governors job. Thats what you feel you are entitled to, a future of little or no work for a unjustly large salary. Now you are throwing a childish tantrum when the new guy at the helm says you have to contribute a few dollars more towards your retirement umbrella. You know he's right, but your ego cannot absorb the blow. If you can't make it on what the contract said when you originally signed up for the job you were handed, too bad. Get a 2nd job to cover your lavish lifestyle. That might involve, oh my goodness, doing some actual work. You can't allow that. Nobody in the real world feels sorrow or pity for you, don't you get that. There were almost no people with jobs that require work rallying with you in Trenton. Only poor you. That's just to bad. " ME FIRST."

Another example of a jealous loser, who thinks he should be handed a job for free. I have a college degree, and it took me 8 years of test taking to get a public safety job. I have no political friends and just stuck with hard work and trying, to get where I am today.

Using the argument that you are suffering so police and fire should be to, makes no sense at all. There are people making thousands upon thousands a year, the same people who started this financial mess, but your blame goes on the cop or firefighter making 80 grand a year?

There were 8 thousand people in trenton, do you know why? Because our so called "greedy unions" told everyone not to call in sick or risk the safety of the public to come down. Police and fire already contribute the most toward their pensions out of every public worker. We cannot strike, and our names are the first to appear in the newspapers, whether we are innocent or guilty of a crime. We are supposed to be "on the job" 24/7. That is why we deserve the contract we all were promised when we signed up for the job.

Everything costs money. This idea that the government owes you something is absurd. Go to college, get a job, and take care of your family and neighbors just like everyone else. There are millions of jobs out there and your argument is with police and fire? I guess all the wall street people get a pass. They ruined the economy, costs the tax payer billions upon billions, and get caught coked up driving their vehicles everyday.

But your right, lay off the young cop on the corner with 3 kids to feed, making 40thousand a year. I'm sure the 40grand is worth the risk to his wife and kids. Keep showing how little you care about the public worker, and morale will dictate how much that worker cares about you. I can assure you, you do not want that to happen.

[Guest guest]

In a few different consecutive posts the firemen have said that firemen make $57,000.00, next one $40,0000, and the last one $80,000.00. You say 8,000 people showed up at the J/O rally, not 6,000. Every newspaper and reporter in NJ said diffrent. Who cares? You TOLD the general public to go to work instead of the crap rally. Since when did anyone in the state of NJ need YOUR permission to do anything? Who the hell are you to TELL private citizens what to do? Your EGO's are so big that nothing gets thru to you. The people have had enought of your welfare job crap and your actual $90,000.00 to $150,000.00 dollar salary. Thats the truth. You think that you are the last person someone thinks about at night and the first thing they think about in the morning. The fireman's problems. People have their own problems and families, what leads you to believe that they give a crap about you. You are a self-centered, egotistical loosely knit street gang that the peoples taxes pay for, and again, as always, anyone who differs from your narrow train of thought you accuse of being on drugs. Drugs seem to be the central point of any conversation you have. Firemen in NJ automatically get a 40% pension if they test positive for drugs, get caught buying drugs, or get caught sellings illegal drugs. No private citizen in the U.S. gets that kind of treatment. I doubt that any private citizen in Harrison are Kearny couldn't even imagine that, and don't dispute it because it's a FACT. The druggies get $40,000.00 or much more depending on their salary a year FOR LIFE for doing drugs and getting fired. It's f***ing outrageous, and that's only after 3 years of service. A lot of people getting rewarded for doing drugs would think it's insane themselves and be on their knees thanking God if they got that $40,000.00 or more FOR LIFE for getting high, and the firemen have the nerve to complain about it. Get it thru your thick skull, nobody cares about you the way you think they do. Christie has the final say and is going to straighen your ***es out, so shut up and take your spanking.

[Guest Guest]

One thing, and the worst thing, I missed. You actually think that your situation with your pension and medical benefits is just as bad as the Holacaust and deaths of 100,000's of thousands innocent Jewish families. You just said it in your post so don't deny it. Your are one sick, evil, and greedy bastard who should be immediately terminated. The Jewish people of NJ would have your head for saying something like that along with many, many others. Me included. That was truly the sickest and filthiest thing I have ever read in my life. I'm sure that many others share my opinion. If I knew who you are I would not be able to control my anger towards a statement such as that, and I'm sure thousands upon thousands of people in this country feel the same way. You are a demented sick, filthy dirty mother*****. May you be treated the same as those innocent people. Unbelievable EGO.

[Guest guest]

This jus sayin guy who supposedly has been a welfare case (FF) for over 20 years is quite in his true to form EGO wonderland. He calls fireman "professional." OMG, go look in the mirror and see what has become of you after 20 years. You probably break a sweat just getting out of bed and you're gonna save someone else? One Batallion Chief in Harrison has to be pushing 350 lbs. of fat on himself. What's he gonna do at a fire. A fireman is not being "on the job," thats a cop. A cop can handle many situations even off duty because of the fact that they are trained to do that and carry a weapon. What could a firemen possibly do off duty? Only one thing, call 911 like any other citizen. They might not have their scotty with them, knock down a backdraft, or be in the same car as Dennis Leary. You live your life off the movies and war stories. Another guy says he is a college graduate and it took him 8 years to become a fireman. It's possible that this guy actually got the job on his own without mommy or daddy visiting the Mayor. That's an anomoly. Although, what college could you graduate from and then it takes you 8 years to get a fireman's welfare job? It had to be one of those bogus online colleges that give you some cheesy diploma for taking your money for years. Credits that a reputable college wouldn't take in a million years. University of Phoenix (lol), they are on TV selling this college BS day and night but no accredited University would consider that as even a good high school. I'm thinking more like Jersey City State College where there is no requirement of intelligence for acceptance, just sign up. They will take anybody stupid enough to pay them. In 8 years you weren't street smart enough to hook-up with some politician and get on a FD in like a year. You welfare cases show more ignorance every time you open your mouth. I said it before, at times in life when you feel like you must say something is the exact time to say nothing. Try it out Mr. College and jus sayin, it works.

[Guest Harrison's Bravest]

This jus sayin guy who supposedly has been a welfare case (FF) for over 20 years is quite in his true to form EGO wonderland. He calls fireman "professional." OMG, go look in the mirror and see what has become of you after 20 years. You probably break a sweat just getting out of bed and you're gonna save someone else? One Batallion Chief in Harrison has to be pushing 350 lbs. of fat on himself. What's he gonna do at a fire. A fireman is not being "on the job," thats a cop. A cop can handle many situations even off duty because of the fact that they are trained to do that and carry a weapon. What could a firemen possibly do off duty? Only one thing, call 911 like any other citizen. They might not have their scotty with them, knock down a backdraft, or be in the same car as Dennis Leary. You live your life off the movies and war stories. Another guy says he is a college graduate and it took him 8 years to become a fireman. It's possible that this guy actually got the job on his own without mommy or daddy visiting the Mayor. That's an anomoly. Although, what college could you graduate from and then it takes you 8 years to get a fireman's welfare job? It had to be one of those bogus online colleges that give you some cheesy diploma for taking your money for years. Credits that a reputable college wouldn't take in a million years. University of Phoenix (lol), they are on TV selling this college BS day and night but no accredited University would consider that as even a good high school. I'm thinking more like Jersey City State College where there is no requirement of intelligence for acceptance, just sign up. They will take anybody stupid enough to pay them. In 8 years you weren't street smart enough to hook-up with some politician and get on a FD in like a year. You welfare cases show more ignorance every time you open your mouth. I said it before, at times in life when you feel like you must say something is the exact time to say nothing. Try it out Mr. College and jus sayin, it works.

Sounds like Barney is getting nervous about the HPD being disolved. Don't sweat it Tin Man, Wal-Marts looking for greeters.

[Guest guest]

I noticed something kinda funny. Mr. Facts, whichever fireman it was posted as guest, seems to have been compiling these pro-fireman statistics for many years. A real creepy thing. Every resource he uses are from fireman organizations, not from any independent sources. I am sure anybody in any job could do the same all the way to a guy selling apples on a street corner. Cry and cry again. It's never enough for MEFIRST. MEFIRST doesn't give a damn about anyone's family except his own. You could drop dead and MEFIRST would probably run your pockets and take your jewelry. Creepy bastards.

[Guest guest]

What does the word "professional" have anything to do in the same sentence as firefighter? A fireman requires that you only need a G.E.D. or high school diploma. You are just like someone that loads or unloads trucks for a living, and those people at least put in a hard day's work for their pay. Them I consider men. A fireman doesn't stand out and say professional to me. It yells out "Below Average Intelligence," or " dimwit." MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!

WAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! Wheres my binky??????????

[Guest Harrison Taxpayer]

What does the word "professional" have anything to do in the same sentence as firefighter? A fireman requires that you only need a G.E.D. or high school diploma. You are just like someone that loads or unloads trucks for a living, and those people at least put in a hard day's work for their pay. Them I consider men. A fireman doesn't stand out and say professional to me. It yells out "Below Average Intelligence," or " dimwit." MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!

WAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! Wheres my binky??????????

I think "guest" is really saying he doesn't make as much money as a firefighter/ EMS professional, his jealousy is very evident in his words. For this goofball to say a firefighter who saves lives and property for a living and makes a comfortable 100k + salary isn't a professional is just dumb.

[Guest Guest]

I noticed something kinda funny. Mr. Facts, whichever fireman it was posted as guest, seems to have been compiling these pro-fireman statistics for many years. A real creepy thing. Every resource he uses are from fireman organizations, not from any independent sources. I am sure anybody in any job could do the same all the way to a guy selling apples on a street corner. Cry and cry again. It's never enough for MEFIRST. MEFIRST doesn't give a damn about anyone's family except his own. You could drop dead and MEFIRST would probably run your pockets and take your jewelry. Creepy bastards.

Really? NJ.com and the university of rutgers are fireman organizations? Thats pretty interesting.

[Guest guest]

For the readers information, NJ.com gets much of it's news from small, independent news sources and a Rutgers Study is a study from an intelligent source? Facts presented on this topic were gotten piecemeal from little known newsgroups and a science project by Rutgers students.