Guest Guest Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 The following link from the Canadian Press, suggesting that their national healthcare is unsustainable. http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianp...D335rGu_Z3KXoQw I am not opposed to "tinkering" with healthcare to cover gaps and shortcomings, but I don't see a wholesale reform as necessary. Least of all, one run by this government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I guess either no one read this, or no one wanted to challenge it. INTERESTING. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I guess either no one read this, or no one wanted to challenge it.INTERESTING. Perhaps the reason no one commented on it is that it is so non-specific. Is the system running out of money? Is it not delivering care to certain pockets of people? There's no clarity in the article, and it doesn't say the system is unsustainable. Without facts to back up the one-word conclusions, it's meaningless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KO Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I guess either no one read this, or no one wanted to challenge it.INTERESTING. Is this the pot you've put all your chips in? All this suggests is that there is an ongoing healthcare debate in Canada too. Contrary to the point you're trying to make, this this article suggests Canadians want to "tinker" with their healthcare system, but never putting it fully in the hands of the private sector. "Doig, who has had a full-time family practice in Saskatoon for 30 years, acknowledges that when physicians have talked about changing the health-care system in the past, they've been accused of wanting an American-style structure. She insists that's not the case. 'It's not about choosing between an American system or a Canadian system,' said Doig. 'The whole thing is about looking at what other people do.'" And where are the Canadians going for solutions to their problem? "The pitch for change at the conference is to start with a presentation from Dr. Robert Ouellet, the current president of the CMA, who has said there's a critical need to make Canada's health-care system patient-centred. He will present details from his fact-finding trip to Europe in January, where he met with health groups in England, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands and France." Wonder what all these countries have in common? I'll let you figure it out, idiot. Nice ace in the hole, buddy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manscape Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Nothing in the article is an endorsement of the U.S. system of healthcare (are you surprised?). They are looking to Europe for examples (are you surprised?) to reform upon....... Your assignment is to rent/borrow Michael Moore's "Sicko" to get a gander about what's wrong with the American healthcare system and to get a clue on how other nations do it.......bear in mind the parasitic profiteers in America that want nothing to change (are you surprised?). Insurance company policies are fine for house fires and auto accidents but have no place in healthcare, NONE. The money that is generated in the business of sickness and injury and FITNESS in all societies should remain between the patient and healthcare providers and their hands-on support staff, not RATIONING and PARASITIC insurance companies who have gotten into the picture through perverse capitalistic evolution while Americans were busy watching Ed Sullivan. Lastly, purchasing health insurance coverage in America is purchasing a "blind item".......no one, no where without the HUGE mechanism of actuarial computation and pertinent statistics can determine what healthcare plan is better than another relative to the premium payment.......insurance reps cling to a favorite policy to sell and promote THAT one for best commissions and to avoid the confusion of "too much choice" for buyers that are mere babes in the woods.....I challenge you to SHOP for healthcare coverage WITHOUT engaging in a dialogue with the insurance reps that sounds like Abbott and Costello's "Who's on First" routine.........it is pure lunacy and the ultimate ruse that people think they know what they're getting! Does it trouble anyone but me that a typical doctor's office has a TEAM of billing/insurance people? Does it create a moment of critical reflection when you stop to understand that the US healthcare system is so ridiculous that an entire dicipline of trained individuals exists in the endeavor of "medical billing"? What a waste of human life and for what? Profiteering upon tragedy.........(the same artificial industry of specialists exists in the cruel IRS tax circus we also have yoked upon us). There is only ONE health care plan that must exist.......a PROPER one for every human being.......one that is universally (hope that word dun scare yee) simplified for all to understand, one that profits those that inject needles, cut flesh and clean bedpans and NOT scumbags in insurance towers, and one that bankrupts NO PATIENT.....because how can healing and fitness be optimized when the instant anxiety of medical bills under the present US system is so often worse than the issue of your health disorder? How do we pay for it? We begin by cutting the U.S. military in half......which will STILL allow the clowns in the pentagon to bully the world.......and don't forget all the money saved for the only meaningful principals (patients and healers/necessary staff) in this issue when insurance companies are kicked to the gutter........ Trust me.....the money is there but EXPECT those that steal it to object VEHEMENTLY. (are you surprised?) Lastly......for those of you that want to undermine my Michael Moore "Sicko" assignment by "swiftboating" him......the people in the film are real.......their experiences EXIST despite your vile disdain for Michael Moore....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 2smart4u Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I guess either no one read this, or no one wanted to challenge it.INTERESTING. Most of the people on this site are raving leftists that worship at the feet of the community organizer. They know ObamaCare will destroy our healthcare system but will not comment against it due to their devotion to their annonted leader. Remember Jim Jones?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Keith Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Most of the people on this site are raving leftists that worship at the feet of the community organizer. They know ObamaCare will destroy our healthcare system but will not comment against it due to their devotion to their annonted leader. Remember Jim Jones?? You know, if we had a better health care system then maybe you could afford to have your head removed from your ass and your foot from your mouth. Everytime you open your mouth it's smells like GW's ass so your condemnation of Obama is falling on deaf ears. You say community organizer like it's a bad thing as opposed to a silver spooned, coke head, alcoholic dimwit who was a failure at everything he did especially president. What would you do to try and provide affordable healthcare for Americans other than say "no? Has anyone noticed all the folks on TV screaming no are problably wealthy enough or have actual insurance that it wouldn't affect them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Is this the pot you've put all your chips in? All this suggests is that there is an ongoing healthcare debate in Canada too. Contrary to the point you're trying to make, this this article suggests Canadians want to "tinker" with their healthcare system, but never putting it fully in the hands of the private sector. "Doig, who has had a full-time family practice in Saskatoon for 30 years, acknowledges that when physicians have talked about changing the health-care system in the past, they've been accused of wanting an American-style structure. She insists that's not the case. 'It's not about choosing between an American system or a Canadian system,' said Doig. 'The whole thing is about looking at what other people do.'" And where are the Canadians going for solutions to their problem? "The pitch for change at the conference is to start with a presentation from Dr. Robert Ouellet, the current president of the CMA, who has said there's a critical need to make Canada's health-care system patient-centred. He will present details from his fact-finding trip to Europe in January, where he met with health groups in England, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands and France." Wonder what all these countries have in common? I'll let you figure it out, idiot. Nice ace in the hole, buddy. Idiot? You don't even know me. But, just for giggles, do you know anyone that lives in Canada? I do. When one of them needed an MRI for a shoulder do you know where they went? They paid out of pocket in Buffalo, NY in the HOPE that they may get pushed forward in line in Canada. You want European healthcare, fine; don't let the door hit you in the ARSE on your way out. Keep "hoping" people, I've given it six months, he's in WAY over his head. (Here comes the Bush bashing, because that may be relevant, LOL!!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ko Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Most of the people on this site are raving leftists that worship at the feet of the community organizer. They know ObamaCare will destroy our healthcare system but will not comment against it due to their devotion to their annonted leader. Remember Jim Jones?? Hey. So you didn't read the article? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Patriot Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Nothing in the article is an endorsement of the U.S. system of healthcare (are you surprised?). They are looking to Europe for examples (are you surprised?) to reform upon.......Your assignment is to rent/borrow Michael Moore's "Sicko" to get a gander about what's wrong with the American healthcare system and to get a clue on how other nations do it.......bear in mind the parasitic profiteers in America that want nothing to change (are you surprised?). Insurance company policies are fine for house fires and auto accidents but have no place in healthcare, NONE. The money that is generated in the business of sickness and injury and FITNESS in all societies should remain between the patient and healthcare providers and their hands-on support staff, not RATIONING and PARASITIC insurance companies who have gotten into the picture through perverse capitalistic evolution while Americans were busy watching Ed Sullivan. Lastly, purchasing health insurance coverage in America is purchasing a "blind item".......no one, no where without the HUGE mechanism of actuarial computation and pertinent statistics can determine what healthcare plan is better than another relative to the premium payment.......insurance reps cling to a favorite policy to sell and promote THAT one for best commissions and to avoid the confusion of "too much choice" for buyers that are mere babes in the woods.....I challenge you to SHOP for healthcare coverage WITHOUT engaging in a dialogue with the insurance reps that sounds like Abbott and Costello's "Who's on First" routine.........it is pure lunacy and the ultimate ruse that people think they know what they're getting! Does it trouble anyone but me that a typical doctor's office has a TEAM of billing/insurance people? Does it create a moment of critical reflection when you stop to understand that the US healthcare system is so ridiculous that an entire dicipline of trained individuals exists in the endeavor of "medical billing"? What a waste of human life and for what? Profiteering upon tragedy.........(the same artificial industry of specialists exists in the cruel IRS tax circus we also have yoked upon us). There is only ONE health care plan that must exist.......a PROPER one for every human being.......one that is universally (hope that word dun scare yee) simplified for all to understand, one that profits those that inject needles, cut flesh and clean bedpans and NOT scumbags in insurance towers, and one that bankrupts NO PATIENT.....because how can healing and fitness be optimized when the instant anxiety of medical bills under the present US system is so often worse than the issue of your health disorder? How do we pay for it? We begin by cutting the U.S. military in half......which will STILL allow the clowns in the pentagon to bully the world.......and don't forget all the money saved for the only meaningful principals (patients and healers/necessary staff) in this issue when insurance companies are kicked to the gutter........ Trust me.....the money is there but EXPECT those that steal it to object VEHEMENTLY. (are you surprised?) Lastly......for those of you that want to undermine my Michael Moore "Sicko" assignment by "swiftboating" him......the people in the film are real.......their experiences EXIST despite your vile disdain for Michael Moore....... Manscum has defined himself completely with this anti-American manifesto. While we're fighting terrorism and maniacs with nukes around the world, this dirtbag thinks we should cut the military in half. We have the best healthcare system in the world but this misinformed wacko thinks we should abandon it. And he quotes Michael Moore as an authority on our healthcare system. Enough said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Keith Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Manscum has defined himself completely with this anti-American manifesto. While we're fighting terrorism and maniacs with nukes around the world, this dirtbag thinks we should cut the military in half. We have the best healthcare system in the world but this misinformed wacko thinks we should abandon it.And he quotes Michael Moore as an authority on our healthcare system. Enough said. Ah yes, more comforting words from the "Hateriot". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manscape Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Manscum has defined himself completely with this anti-American manifesto. While we're fighting terrorism and maniacs with nukes around the world, this dirtbag thinks we should cut the military in half. We have the best healthcare system in the world but this misinformed wacko thinks we should abandon it.And he quotes Michael Moore as an authority on our healthcare system. Enough said. June 4, 2009, 2:36 pm Medical Bills Cause Most Bankruptcies By Tara Parker-Pope Nearly two out of three bankruptcies stem from medical bills, and even people with health insurance face financial disaster if they experience a serious illness, a new study shows. The study data, published online Thursday in The American Journal of Medicine, likely understate the full scope of the problem because the data were collected before the current economic crisis. In 2007, medical problems contributed to 62.1 percent of all bankruptcies. Between 2001 and 2007, the proportion of all bankruptcies attributable to medical problems rose by about 50 percent. “The U.S. health care financing system is broken, and not only for the poor and uninsured,” the study authors wrote. “Middle-class families frequently collapse under the strain of a health care system that treats physical wounds, but often inflicts fiscal ones.” The data on medical bankruptcy, compiled by researchers at Harvard Law School, Harvard Medical School and Ohio University, is based on a survey of 2,314 randomly selected bankruptcy filers during early 2007. Among families who were bankrupted by illness, those with private insurance reported average medical bills of $17,749 compared to those who were uninsured, who faced an average of $26,971 in medical costs. Those who had health insurance but lost it in the course of their illness reported average medical bills of $22,568. Hospital costs accounted for about half the expenses (48 percent), followed by prescription drugs (18.6 percent), doctor’s bills (15.1 percent) and insurance premiums (4.1 percent). Medical equipment and nursing home care rounded out the list. The health problems that left patients with the highest out-of-pocket expenses were ranked as follows: Neurologic (i.e., multiple sclerosis): $34,167 Diabetes: $26,971 Injuries: 25,096 Stroke: $23,380 Mental illnesses: $23,178 Heart disease: $21,955 http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/04/m...t-bankruptcies/ .............."enough said" patriot deadender?........or shall I continue your forum thrashing by citing the bloatedly corrupt cult that the U.S. military is via the V-22 Osprey boondoggle as the flagship example? hmmmmmmmmmm? (psssssssttttttt, deadender patriotic? As far as all those evil terrorists you keep seeing in your cornflakes.....there are some mighty impressive psychotropic drugs available to make them ALL GO AWAY.....if you can afford the prescription!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Idiot? You don't even know me. But, just for giggles, do you know anyone that lives in Canada? I do.When one of them needed an MRI for a shoulder do you know where they went? They paid out of pocket in Buffalo, NY in the HOPE that they may get pushed forward in line in Canada. You want European healthcare, fine; don't let the door hit you in the ARSE on your way out. Keep "hoping" people, I've given it six months, he's in WAY over his head. (Here comes the Bush bashing, because that may be relevant, LOL!!!) You know one person who told you he went to Buffalo for an MRI. Assuming the person was telling the truth, so what? What condition did he have? Did the MRI find anything? Did the person need surgery? Did the person have surgery? If the person didn't have surgery, maybe it's because the doctors had already determined clinically that an MRI wasn't necessary. Either way, millions of people in the United States are being denied important care, including surgery, because they don't have coverage. If you bothered to look, you could easily find a slew of worse cases right here in the USA. Did you think of any of that? Of course not. One person complained, you thought it supported your political viewpoint, so you believed it and decided that your one story is sufficient reason to sink the entire Canadian health care system. Fact is, Canadians like their health care system and they think we're crazy letting insurance companies rob us blind. And we really don't need you telling the rest of us that if we don't agree with you, we should move to another country. That doesn't say anything good about your understanding of what it means to be an American. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Manscum has defined himself completely with this anti-American manifesto. While we're fighting terrorism and maniacs with nukes around the world, this dirtbag thinks we should cut the military in half. We have the best healthcare system in the world but this misinformed wacko thinks we should abandon it. And he quotes Michael Moore as an authority on our healthcare system. Enough said. We DO NOT have the best health care in the world. By measure after measure, we are significantly behind other industrialized countries in longevity, child mortality and a long list of other measures; and we're paying much more per capita for our health care than they are. Standing up for our country is good but when you take it to such an extreme that you ignore reality, you're not doing our country any favors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ko Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Idiot? You don't even know me. But, just for giggles, do you know anyone that lives in Canada? I do.When one of them needed an MRI for a shoulder do you know where they went? They paid out of pocket in Buffalo, NY in the HOPE that they may get pushed forward in line in Canada. You want European healthcare, fine; don't let the door hit you in the ARSE on your way out. Keep "hoping" people, I've given it six months, he's in WAY over his head. (Here comes the Bush bashing, because that may be relevant, LOL!!!) You didn't even review your own evidence. You started a topic against universal health care by presenting an article about the "unsustainable" Canadian system. The article, however, doesn't imply that the system is unsustainable because it is government funded, except for one vague quote near the end ("how are we going to pay for this"). The system, according to the incoming CMA president, needs "change," but, as I mentioned earlier, nobody in the Canadian health care debate (as evidenced by this article) is interested in an American system. So, as you can clearly see, you ARE an idiot. And you're probably fat and ugly too. MORON! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Idiot? You don't even know me. But, just for giggles, do you know anyone that lives in Canada? I do.When one of them needed an MRI for a shoulder do you know where they went? They paid out of pocket in Buffalo, NY in the HOPE that they may get pushed forward in line in Canada. You want European healthcare, fine; don't let the door hit you in the ARSE on your way out. Keep "hoping" people, I've given it six months, he's in WAY over his head. (Here comes the Bush bashing, because that may be relevant, LOL!!!) I don't believe you. Just as you right wing opponents make up "Death Panel" stories, you also make up these little anecdotes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manscape Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 It's time to recognize the prime danger to the very survival of the United States comes from those that habitually assert to define who's a "REAL AMERICAN"......... http://www.joebageant.com/joe/2009/08/the-...ng-grandma.html The Entertainment Value of Snuffing Grandma A nation of children roots for the Mafia By Joe Bageant Every day I get letters asking me to weigh in on the healthcare fracas. As if a redneck writer armed with a keyboard, a pack of smokes and all the misinformation and vitriol available on the Internet could contribute anything to the crap storm already in progress. Besides that, my unreasoned but noisy take on this issue is often about as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit. None of which has ever stopped me from making a fool of myself in the past. So here goes. There ain't any healthcare debate going on, Bubba. What is going on are mob negotiations about insurance, and which mob gets the biggest chunk of the dough, be it our taxpayer dough or the geet that isn't in ole Jim's impoverished purse. The hoo-ha is about the insurance racket, not the delivery of healthcare to human beings. It's simply another form of extorting the people regarding a fundamental need -- health. Unfortunately, the people have been mesmerized by our theater state's purposefully distracting and dramatic media productions for so long they've been mutated toward helplessness. Consequently, they are incapable of asking themselves a simple question: If insurance corporation profits are one third of the cost of healthcare, and all insurance corporations do is deliver our money to healthcare providers for us (or actually, do everything in their power to keep the money for themselves), why do we need insurance companies at all? Answer: Because Wall Street gets a big piece of the action. And nobody messes with the Wall Street Mob (as the bailout extortion money proved). Better (and worse) presidents have tried. Some made a genuine effort to push it through Congress. Others expressed the desire publicly, but after getting privately muscled by the healthcare industry, decided to back off from the idea. For instance: Franklin Roosevelt wanted universal healthcare. Harry Truman wanted universal healthcare. Dwight Eisenhower wanted universal healthcare. Richard Nixon wanted universal healthcare. Lyndon Johnson wanted universal healthcare. Bill Clinton wanted -- well we can't definitely say because he made sure that if the issue blew up on him, which it did, Hillary would be left holding the turd. Is it any wonder that woman gets so snappy at the slightest provocation? First getting left to hold the bag on healthcare, then the spots on that blue dress. So why did American liberals believe Obama would bring home the healthcare bacon? Because they live in an ideological cupcake land. It's a big neighborhood, a very special place where "Your vote is important," and "by electing the right candidate, you can change our beloved nation." Most of America lives in that neighborhood, even though they've never personally met. It's a place where the shrubbery and flowerbeds of such things as "values" and "hope" bloom. Hope that our desires coupled with the efforts of a good and decent president can affect "change." Evidently these voters never heard the old adage, "Hope in one hand and piss in the other, and see which one fills up first." The slaughter of the innocents by the healthcare lobby has pretty much extinguished the political usefulness of the word hope. Nobody, especially Obama, uses it now. The first on-stage scuffle of the Obama administration, government assured healthcare, quickly settled down into the accustomed scenario of very rich and powerful people in expensive suits "finding middle ground," otherwise known as the status quo. Single payer healthcare soon became "a consumer government alternative to private insurance," and is now "a system of health cooperatives. Next comes "slightly better health insurance (but not medical services) than before, from the same insurance companies but at twice the price; don't worry though, we're increasing your tax load so you can afford it." The televised screaming matches, having served their purpose, are over now. The presidency and the nation have settled back into the normalcy of the officially sanctioned state consciousness and its curious non-language, one modified and shaped daily by corporate and government symbiosis. Over generations we've come to internalize this imagistic language, which is quite theatrical when heated up for public consumption and dully bureaucratic when attention is to be avoided. But always it is void of content and any sort of truth. In the corporately managed theater state, it's not whether a thing is true that matters, but how it sounds and looks and what you call it. Call end of life counseling a "death panel," and you've just turned mercy and choice into one more Great Satan. In the end though, healthcare American style comes down to the preferences of two elite castes, Congress and corporate powers, neither of which can exist without the other. Corporations need the government to sanction their methods of extracting wealth from the public. Congress needs corporations to finance its campaign chariot races. Right now members of Congress have an excellent chance of putting the arm on healthcare industry lobbyist for some real cash: Senator Smedley Heathwood: "Oh, I dunno, I'm sort of liking Obama's alternative." Godzilla Healthcare Inc.: "Here, take this suitcase full of gold bullion, call me if you run short. And remember, we've got that ‘Life is a pre-existing condition' bill coming up in the Senate soon." Siamese twins, joined at the hip, they share the same goal, preservation of control -- the government's social control and the corporations' economic control. And you cannot have one without the other. Obama got elected on hope of reform, despite that one cannot reform a mafia, only pay increased extortion moneys. He's fortunate that it was not a genuine demand for reform, just hope. We're fortunate we did not demand reform because we're not going to get it. Obama doesn't have to reform the healthcare industry mob. All he has to do is look like he took a shot at it, and hope it's convincing enough. What we've seen is probably his best shot, too. Why not? There is always the off chance it might work, in which case his "presidential legacy" would be assured. And if it doesn't, well, the serious progressives who are screeching mad at him now will still have to vote for him as the incumbent in 2012. Or learn to love somebody like Mitt Romney, Sarah Palin, Mike Huckabee, Jeb Bush, Rick Santorum (take your pick) or some as-yet-unknown the GOP drags out from under the hen house and ballyhoos as a "new face." Luckily, Dick Cheney is out of the question, barring a coup by the far right wing of the schizophrenic GOP. But still, after Palin, one shudders at the prospects. Whatever happens, we will not see Congress stand up against the extortion of its people by the healthcare industry. We will not see even the most ordinary kind of healthcare declared as a human right, as it is in so many other nations. We will see, however, greater access to the public treasury by the insurance corporations. Every nation in the world is now party to at least one treaty that addresses health as a human right, including the conditions necessary for the delivery of health services. Healthcare is a right under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Hell, even Saddam Hussein provided healthcare. That Americans cannot grasp this fundamental aspect of human rights (but then we cannot even get child nutrition, or limiting the number of times you can taser an old lady in an airport, out of the starting gate) and join the civilized world and assure its people of such things is testimony. Testimony that we live in a vacuum exclusive of the accepted standard of mercy and decency common to civilized democratic nations elsewhere. Testimony that even we the citizenry would rather maintain and spread lies than accept truths such as most people in countries with universal healthcare would not ever give it up in favor of the U.S. system. Most of all though, it is testimony that we live under an induced mass hallucination where spectacle replaces fact, information and common sense. In place of actionable information, we are served up screaming red faces -- angry mobs manufactured for TV protesting "government interference in the people's healthcare choices." One must wonder what inchoate anger is really being tapped by the organizers of these strange "citizen protests." As usual, the straw boogeyman of socialism is once more invoked. "Oh my god! I'll have to give up my $1,100 a month insurance bill, which only pays 80% of my insurance costs AFTER I pay the initial $5,000 of those costs! If that ain't Joe Stalin all over again, I don't know what is!" We get the false media drama of "death panels." And being captives of spectacle and hyperbole, we friggin love it. The idea of death panels plays to our childish attraction to the extreme and entertaining. Killing Grandma is far more entertaining to our imaginations than say, guaranteed access to chest screens and blood pressure medicine. Two generations into this national infantilization, it's now the only national life we know -- the ideological spectacle made real. To steal a page from Guy Debord, society has become ideology. We live in an antidialectical false consciousness, imposed at every moment on everyday life as spectacle. We are held in thrall. Our faculty of ordinary encounter has been systematically broken down. In its place we now have our unique social hallucination. Never do we encounter anything directly, yet we get the illusion of encounter. This includes encounter with each other. Anyone who lives in meatspace with his or her fellow Americans could not deny 57 million of them health. In this society no one is any longer capable of recognizing anyone else. Instead, we see others as the screamers at the town hall meetings, or as communists who want to give free healthcare to illegals and establish death panels. Or as Christian fundamentalists, or as liberals or conservatives. Or as celebrities or as nobodies. But most importantly, whenever we must reach any significant agreement as human beings, whether it be about something as globally insignificant as U.S. domestic policy (we are only 6% of the world population, and though it hasn't soaked in yet to most Americans, we're also broke and owe the Chinese loan shark a wad) or as significant as global warming, we immediately cede the field to ideology. We simply don't know how to do anything else. Ideology has utterly triumphed. It has separated us from ourselves and built itself a home inside our consciousness, from whence it operates now as our reality. There is no going back, only forward. Given that we are a nation of children who prefer to close our eyes and make a hopeful wish with Tinkerbelle, rather than give hope the piss test, then let us hope to high hell. We may as well go for broke. So let us hope that, in going forward, new and unforeseen developments in the national consciousness occur. Developments that offer an escape from this one so deeply colonized by the corpo-political machinery we created -- and which in turn recreated us. One that will break us loose from enthrallment. Maybe collision with a giant asteroid. Or that Garth Brooks will be barred from making a fifth comeback tour. That's one hope. A consciousness shattering event by American standards. Another hope is for an absolute and total collapse of the system. At this point, I'll take what I can get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 June 4, 2009, 2:36 pm Medical Bills Cause Most Bankruptcies By Tara Parker-Pope Nearly two out of three bankruptcies stem from medical bills, and even people with health insurance face financial disaster if they experience a serious illness, a new study shows. The study data, published online Thursday in The American Journal of Medicine, likely understate the full scope of the problem because the data were collected before the current economic crisis. In 2007, medical problems contributed to 62.1 percent of all bankruptcies. Between 2001 and 2007, the proportion of all bankruptcies attributable to medical problems rose by about 50 percent. “The U.S. health care financing system is broken, and not only for the poor and uninsured,” the study authors wrote. “Middle-class families frequently collapse under the strain of a health care system that treats physical wounds, but often inflicts fiscal ones.” The data on medical bankruptcy, compiled by researchers at Harvard Law School, Harvard Medical School and Ohio University, is based on a survey of 2,314 randomly selected bankruptcy filers during early 2007. Among families who were bankrupted by illness, those with private insurance reported average medical bills of $17,749 compared to those who were uninsured, who faced an average of $26,971 in medical costs. Those who had health insurance but lost it in the course of their illness reported average medical bills of $22,568. Hospital costs accounted for about half the expenses (48 percent), followed by prescription drugs (18.6 percent), doctor’s bills (15.1 percent) and insurance premiums (4.1 percent). Medical equipment and nursing home care rounded out the list. The health problems that left patients with the highest out-of-pocket expenses were ranked as follows: Neurologic (i.e., multiple sclerosis): $34,167 Diabetes: $26,971 Injuries: 25,096 Stroke: $23,380 Mental illnesses: $23,178 Heart disease: $21,955 http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/04/m...t-bankruptcies/ .............."enough said" patriot deadender?........or shall I continue your forum thrashing by citing the bloatedly corrupt cult that the U.S. military is via the V-22 Osprey boondoggle as the flagship example? hmmmmmmmmmm? (psssssssttttttt, deadender patriotic? As far as all those evil terrorists you keep seeing in your cornflakes.....there are some mighty impressive psychotropic drugs available to make them ALL GO AWAY.....if you can afford the prescription!) Let me guess, you hate the military because you're gay and you know gays don't do well in the services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2009 Report Share Posted August 26, 2009 So, this, from a British newspaper. Boy I can't wait until government puts its hands into OUR healthcare. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12...s-took-out.html Change IS coming. Thanks to the sheeple that voted for this mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ko Posted August 26, 2009 Report Share Posted August 26, 2009 So, this, from a British newspaper. Boy I can't wait until government puts its hands into OUR healthcare.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12...s-took-out.html Change IS coming. Thanks to the sheeple that voted for this mess. Happens in all systems, pal. That isn't HALF as bad as THIS: http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/07/01/waiting.r...eath/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Keith Posted August 26, 2009 Report Share Posted August 26, 2009 So, this, from a British newspaper. Boy I can't wait until government puts its hands into OUR healthcare.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12...s-took-out.html Change IS coming. Thanks to the sheeple that voted for this mess. That's bullshit arguement and you know it. The doctors made a mistake. It happens here in the US right now, everyday WITHOUT the govt. putting it's hands into OUR healthcare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2009 Report Share Posted August 26, 2009 That's bullshit arguement and you know it. The doctors made a mistake. It happens here in the US right now, everyday WITHOUT the govt. putting it's hands into OUR healthcare. Oh, my, did I hit a nerve quick call Dr. Obama!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 Oh, my, did I hit a nerve quick call Dr. Obama!!! I swear, you have to practice to get this stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Keith Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 Oh, my, did I hit a nerve quick call Dr. Obama!!! No, like I said it's a bullshit arguement and I think you may be too stupid to really grasp your own post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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