Talk of secession

[Guest Paul]

When we liberals opposed the Iraqi war, correctly as the world now knows, we were labeled as traitors who hated our country. Yet we never talked of seceding from the United States. We just disagreed, as it is every American's right to do - you wouldn't have thought so from the reaction. The Dixie Chicks were banned from radio stations because the audiences were so-called "conservatives." Very few dared to speak out for fear of being labeled unpatriotic. That's not conservatism. That's anti-American radicalism, opposed to the very principles that make the USA the USA.

Now we see the Governor of Texas talking about secession. According to the latest poll, 31% of Texans agree.

This is pure hypocrisy, and worse it is an attack on the union. They lost the election, so they want to pick up their ball and leave. It's disgusting. Unlike the civil disagreement we liberals had with the Iraqi war, this truly is unpatriotic - because this isn't just dissent and disagreement. It is a call to break up the United States of America. How can we hold a country together with people behaving like this?

[Guest 2smart4u]

When we liberals opposed the Iraqi war, correctly as the world now knows, we were labeled as traitors who hated our country. Yet we never talked of seceding from the United States. We just disagreed, as it is every American's right to do - you wouldn't have thought so from the reaction. The Dixie Chicks were banned from radio stations because the audiences were so-called "conservatives." Very few dared to speak out for fear of being labeled unpatriotic. That's not conservatism. That's anti-American radicalism, opposed to the very principles that make the USA the USA.

Now we see the Governor of Texas talking about secession. According to the latest poll, 31% of Texans agree.

This is pure hypocrisy, and worse it is an attack on the union. They lost the election, so they want to pick up their ball and leave. It's disgusting. Unlike the civil disagreement we liberals had with the Iraqi war, this truly is unpatriotic - because this isn't just dissent and disagreement. It is a call to break up the United States of America. How can we hold a country together with people behaving like this?

Yet another lecture from the master of hypocrisy. If you want "anti-American radicalism" look no further than the mirror.

[Guest Guest]

Yet another lecture from the master of hypocrisy. If you want "anti-American radicalism" look no further than the mirror.

Don't ever get tired of wasting everyone's time saying nothing?

[WilliamK]

Now we see the Governor of Texas talking about secession. According to the latest poll, 31% of Texans agree.

This is pure hypocrisy, and worse it is an attack on the union. They lost the election, so they want to pick up their ball and leave. It's disgusting. Unlike the civil disagreement we liberals had with the Iraqi war, this truly is unpatriotic - because this isn't just dissent and disagreement. It is a call to break up the United States of America. How can we hold a country together with people behaving like this?

Unpatriotic is an understatement. A secession attempt would be an act of war against the United States.

As to hypocrisy, how much would you want to bet that a significant portion of that 31% are self-proclaimed "patriots" who can be found waving the stars-and-stripes at republican rallies?

Whether he takes secession seriously or not, Perry is playing a very irresponsible and dangerous political game with this. It will appeal to the wingnut base, which is pretty large in Texas. It is hard to predict at this point, but this might improve his odds in a primary against Kay Bailey Hutchison, who so far appears to have a significant edge. But it also "stirs the pot" of far-right extremists at a time that is ripe for that particular flavor of radicalism. Though still around, the Republic of Texas secessionists have pretty much disappeared from public view in the time that has passed since one of their factions made headlines in a hostage-taking and standoff with the law back in '97. Now their cause is getting attention again, and these groups may be reinvigorated by this.

[Guest Guest]

Yet another lecture from the master of hypocrisy. If you want "anti-American radicalism" look no further than the mirror.

You'll be MUCH more successful finding the bane of America by looking in Crawford/Dallas Texas.

[Guest Guest]

Unpatriotic is an understatement. A secession attempt would be an act of war against the United States.

As to hypocrisy, how much would you want to bet that a significant portion of that 31% are self-proclaimed "patriots" who can be found waving the stars-and-stripes at republican rallies?

Whether he takes secession seriously or not, Perry is playing a very irresponsible and dangerous political game with this. It will appeal to the wingnut base, which is pretty large in Texas. It is hard to predict at this point, but this might improve his odds in a primary against Kay Bailey Hutchison, who so far appears to have a significant edge. But it also "stirs the pot" of far-right extremists at a time that is ripe for that particular flavor of radicalism. Though still around, the Republic of Texas secessionists have pretty much disappeared from public view in the time that has passed since one of their factions made headlines in a hostage-taking and standoff with the law back in '97. Now their cause is getting attention again, and these groups may be reinvigorated by this.

I hate to tell you , but your wrong, its not an act of war, in fact a state has the right to break away from the union if it has the support of other states, there is a federal case i believe its texas vs (someone) google it. And the governor didn't say he wanted to break away, he said that he could break away, which all states have the right to do so , under the constitution. It was just a political statement, just like some governors aren't taking stim. money...Republicans, Democrats, they are s**k, we the people, are not represented well at all. They need to have term limits in congress. Its really getting out of control. In a perfect world, regular everyday people would represent us in the government, but you know that isn't happening

[Guest Paul]

I hate to tell you , but your wrong, its not an act of war, in fact a state has the right to break away from the union if it has the support of other states, there is a federal case i believe its texas vs (someone) google it. And the governor didn't say he wanted to break away, he said that he could break away, which all states have the right to do so , under the constitution. It was just a political statement, just like some governors aren't taking stim. money...Republicans, Democrats, they are s**k, we the people, are not represented well at all. They need to have term limits in congress. Its really getting out of control. In a perfect world, regular everyday people would represent us in the government, but you know that isn't happening

Whatever the law may hold, no responsible political figure talks like that. The only possible effect, or purpose, is to stir division and anger. It is irresponsible.

[WilliamK]

I hate to tell you , but your wrong, its not an act of war, in fact a state has the right to break away from the union if it has the support of other states, there is a federal case i believe its texas vs (someone) google it.

Ok. I'll amend my statement by inserting the word "Unilateral". Secession without either the agreement of the country being seceded from, or a pre-established legal right to do so, would be an act of war. I know that secessionists like to assert that such a legal right exists, but they have failed to establish convincingly (other than convincing themselves) that this is the case. The contrary case is much stronger. The constitutionality of unilateral secession has, in fact, been tested by the U.S. Supreme Court (Texas vs. White, which is probably what you're referring to). It failed the test.

So, as Texas lacks both the agreement of the union, and any established legal right to unilateral secession, any secession move stronger than asking for permission would be an act of war. Ratifying a declaration of independence, for example.

And the governor didn't say he wanted to break away, he said that he could break away, ...

That much is true. And you'll notice that I've not claimed otherwise.

...which all states have the right to do so , under the constitution.

Only if the union blesses it. Without that, no such right exists.

The last time a group of states (one of which was Texas) tried to unilaterally secede produced a rather well-known war. Notice also that all of them are still part of the union.

[Guest Guest]

you can almost understand a state who is financially stable and idependant wanting to be seperate... I mean the only reason other then being patriotic , to stay in the union would be for safety purposes, but nobody is going to invade texas because the united states protects everyone..its why canada does not need to spend billions on military. That being said, i feel its a slap in the face to every man and woman who ever died for this country. whether it be over seas or on our own soil, blood has been spilled to form a more perfect union. Simply stating the fact you want to break away is, in my opinion tasteless. But this america and you can say what you want, but as a conservative, im embarassed by his statements. Any hint of weakening our country is terrible. Yes, there are certain states that do not produce as much or may use more federal tax dollars, but that doesn't mean you cut ties and leave them out to dry...we are one country, look how far russia has fallen from the days of the U.S.S.R. Money truely is the route to all evil...

[Guest Guest]

you can almost understand a state who is financially stable and idependant wanting to be seperate... I mean the only reason other then being patriotic , to stay in the union would be for safety purposes, but nobody is going to invade texas because the united states protects everyone..its why canada does not need to spend billions on military. That being said, i feel its a slap in the face to every man and woman who ever died for this country. whether it be over seas or on our own soil, blood has been spilled to form a more perfect union. Simply stating the fact you want to break away is, in my opinion tasteless. But this america and you can say what you want, but as a conservative, im embarassed by his statements. Any hint of weakening our country is terrible. Yes, there are certain states that do not produce as much or may use more federal tax dollars, but that doesn't mean you cut ties and leave them out to dry...we are one country, look how far russia has fallen from the days of the U.S.S.R. Money truely is the route to all evil...

If Texas hadn't been part of the USA all these years, it wouldn't be as well-off or as secure as it is. People tend to think that all the good things they have are just part of nature, when in reality they are the products of hard work and organization, including government.

[Guest 2smart4u]

Whatever the law may hold, no responsible political figure talks like that. The only possible effect, or purpose, is to stir division and anger. It is irresponsible.

I wonder what Kris would think about this? Hmmmmm.