More Defeatocratic Highlights

[Guest Patriot]

Guest, your question is an excellent one. As a veteran of the Viet Nam war, I could see what was going to happen in Iraq. I retired rather that have to serve in another quagmire.

I believed that on September 13, 2007 when President Bush said we would get the ones that did this to us we would go into Afghanistan and volunteered to go. Since they were only sending 10,000 troops my request was denied. And if you remember most of the world was behind us.

That all changed when, for whater reason or excuse we are hearing now the rules changed. Was Hussein a bad person? Absolutely. Was he a threat? Absolutely not. However, they do have the largest Oil reserves in the world which might have something to do with why we went in.

General Shinseki who was the Army Chief of Staff told Rumsfeld and the White House that if we were going to invade we would need 500,000 troops to do the job right. They didn't listen then and they still aren't listening.

Absolutely I want to bring the troops home now. Their mission was to over throw Sadaam and they did that. It wasn't to stay there and have our troops stuck in a civil war. And whether the right wing wants to admit it or not that is exactly what's happening. In fact the overwhelming majority of american's want us out.

The reason I mentioned Viet Nam is because what is happening now in Iraq is a parralel to what happened there. One small difference is that the Iraqi Government is the first weak regime we are supporting. In Nam we supported atleast three. And the end result was we bore the brunt of the combat deaths and injuries just like now. As far as a fighting force, the South Vietnamese were as worthless as the Iraqi army is today. Once they saw that we were willing to fight they felt they didn't have to. Today as you are reading this, three more americans died. How many iraqi soldiers died today?.

When the Democrats voted to give the president more money for the troop it was with the intention of insuring the troops had what they need. While I believe they are as sorry as the President we'll see what happens in September. In fact, I wrote to my Congressman and vented my disgust about giving any more money. Fortunately he voted against funding.

Once you have been to war, you look at going to war a lot differently than ones who didn't which I think is part of the problem. We can't solve the problems over there. Only they can. And as long as their priorities are whether to go on vacation for two months shouldn't we start to bring troops home now? In reality it's the only way to force them to do something/anything.

And to my right wing friends you need not respond to this message. I already know what you think which is what caused us to get into this mess in the first place.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You served in Viet Nam and retired rather than serve in Iraq ??? Since the wars are more than 25 years apart, if you were a veteran of Viet Nam, you would have been out of the military before 9/11/01. I think you're a phony, "proud american". I think the closest you ever got to the military is reading Action Comics.

[Guest a proud american]

You served in Viet Nam and retired rather than serve in Iraq  ???  Since the wars are more than 25 years apart, if you were a veteran of  Viet Nam, you would have been out of the military before 9/11/01. I think you're a phony, "proud american". I think the closest you ever got to the military is reading Action Comics.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I went into the Army in 1969. I served in Viet Nam from 70 to 71 and was discharged in 1972. After having been out for a few years I went back in. I retired on December 30, 2003. And as far as being a phony, I don't have to justify my reasoning to you or any of your fellow keyboard commando's. As I remember correctly you claim to be a Marine Veteran. Veteran of what? As for why I retired, I went through one war and in fact, volunteered to go to Afghanistan. I just wasn't going to go through another war that was poorly planned, ineptly instituted and which was based on mistruths and lies. As for you, what sacrifices have you made? Have you sent any of your family over there? Of course we already know the answer to that one don't we. So be my guest, question my military record all you want. You like to sign off by saying semper fi. What that means to me is send someone else just as long as it isn't me or my family.

[Strife767]

A more threatening fact is that 35% of U.S. citizens are registered Defeatocrats.

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http://tinyurl.com/54kpy

[Guest Guest]

You must be a defeatocrat. You certainly have that defeatocratic attitude.

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I guess in your shriveled little prune of a brain being acquainted with facts and the truth is not a good thing.

[Autonomous]

You served in Viet Nam and retired rather than serve in Iraq  ???  Since the wars are more than 25 years apart, if you were a veteran of  Viet Nam, you would have been out of the military before 9/11/01. I think you're a phony, "proud american". I think the closest you ever got to the military is reading Action Comics.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Seriously, how hard is it to Google "Vietnam Veterans in Iraq" to avoid this? Here's the first result of A LOT:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/20...tnam-vets_x.htm

Guess they're lying.

[Guest Patriot]

I went into the Army in 1969. I served in Viet Nam from 70 to 71 and was discharged in 1972. After having been out for a few years I went back in. I retired on December 30, 2003. And as far as being a phony, I don't have to justify my reasoning to you or any of your fellow keyboard commando's. As I remember correctly you claim to be a Marine Veteran. Veteran of what? As for why I retired, I went through one war and in fact, volunteered to go to Afghanistan. I just wasn't going to go through another war that was poorly planned, ineptly instituted and which was based on mistruths and lies. As for you, what sacrifices have you made? Have you sent any of your family over there? Of course we already know the answer to that one don't we. So be my guest, question my military record all you want. You like to sign off by saying semper fi. What that means to me is send someone else just as long as it isn't me or my family.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I joined the Marines out of college in 1970 as a 2nd Lt. Got out in '76, spent one year in Nam as a logistics officer, didn't see any direct combat. As to your question about sending any of my family to Afganistan, I tried to send my mother-in-law but she wouldn't go. Sorry.

[Guest a proud american]

I joined the Marines out of college in 1970 as a 2nd Lt.  Got out in '76, spent one year in Nam as a logistics officer, didn't see any direct combat.  As to your question about sending any of my family to Afganistan, I tried to send my mother-in-law but she wouldn't go. Sorry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hear that NASA is looking to send some seniors to the moon. Perhaps she could look for Alice Kramden. as far asyour service welcome home even if it's a few years late.

While you and I don't see this war in the same way, I can now atleast respect your opinion. My only point has been and maybe you will agree is that what we went through should not be wished on this generation of soldiers. I won't speak for others, only myself. I chose to retire because it was the wrong war at the wrong time. Whenever I see a soldier or airman or sailor I walk up to them and thank them for their service. Also, my wife and I are in the process of adopting a soldier. They have no family and like the VFW letter writing campaign people receive a name of a soldier and then write and send care packages to them. It's not hard to do and you need only contact a unit and get a name. If you are interested, I will get a name for you or anyone who would like to participate. This might be one way for all of us who either agree or disagree to do something positive.

[Guest Guest]

A more threatening fact is that 35% of U.S. citizens are registered Defeatocrats.

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Here's a REAL threatening fact. While your man The Shrub was wasting time pursuing his little personal vendetta against Saddam al Qaeda has rebuilt to pre 9/11 levels. So much for getting those responsible for 9/11. Keep apologizing for the incompetent misleader, WANKER!

[Guest Guest]

I joined the Marines out of college in 1970 as a 2nd Lt.  Got out in '76, spent one year in Nam as a logistics officer, didn't see any direct combat.  As to your question about sending any of my family to Afganistan, I tried to send my mother-in-law but she wouldn't go. Sorry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So now we know your're just a chest thumping REMF

[Autonomous]

I joined the Marines out of college in 1970 as a 2nd Lt.  Got out in '76, spent one year in Nam as a logistics officer, didn't see any direct combat.  As to your question about sending any of my family to Afganistan, I tried to send my mother-in-law but she wouldn't go. Sorry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It doesn't matter.

On at least three occasions you have accused your fellow posters of lying about their service records. To 'support' this accusation you declared that it was impossible for a Vietnam vet to still be enlisted today.

The first problem is a flaw in your logic. I defeated your theory in seconds with a simple Google search. There are plenty of people serving in Iraq who served in 'Nam. Now, this isn't really a character flaw. I would hope one would test a theory before accusing others of such heinous dishonesty, but it could be just an oversight.

The second problem is only a problem in my specific case. I never claimed to be a Vietnam veteran. Now you might have been lying-but you might have been mistaken. Unlike you, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Either way the choices are dishonesty or egregious oversight (again).

The result, however, is what is most telling. You have never apologized to either of us for accusing us of lying. For that matter, you haven't even admitted that you were wrong.

So it doesn't matter what your service record is. It doesn't matter whether or not you and 2Dim are the same person. It doesn't even matter whether or not you were man enough for the Marines. The one unquestionable fact is that you are NOT man enough to take responsibility for your own actions here.

[Guest Guest]

I joined the Marines out of college in 1970 as a 2nd Lt.  Got out in '76, spent one year in Nam as a logistics officer, didn't see any direct combat.  As to your question about sending any of my family to Afganistan, I tried to send my mother-in-law but she wouldn't go. Sorry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good for you, and thank you for your service. That doesn't mean that you should spend the rest of your life telling everyone else that they haven't served their country too. You don't make yourself more by trying to make other people less. Just the opposite, your make yourself less, not them.

Maybe you don't realize it, but nearly everyone honors the people who have served in our military . . . until you go on a campaign to spend the rest of your life reminding us of it. When you do that, you diminish the honor with which you once served.

What do you want? An apology for putting your life on the line while others stayed here? To be fed grapes the rest of your life because you once served your country? You knew that wasn't part of the deal. A medal or another medal as the case may be? You can live in the past if you want to, but don't expect the rest of us to live there with you.

Hoping this might get through a very thick and angry head.