Attempted intimidation

[an American in Texas]

You can't operate a government without teaching metaphysics at some level, and the problem (such as it is) is compounded by government involvement in schooling.  Somebody's values will be taught, either explicitly or implicity (and John Dewey realized this).

Your group is the religion of the future, forcing itself on the population through the courts, using the courts to twist the Constitution into funny balloon animals.  Your interest group doesn't get its way by legislation through the democratic process.  Instead, it coerces institutions with threats of lawsuits and rewrites the law via the interpretations of judges.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bryan "metaphysics at some level" hardly equates to the blatant preaching of fundamentalist Christian doctrine in a classroom.

It's you who misunderstands the relationship between "the democratic process", by which I infer you mean "rule of the majority", and the Constitution. You don't like it that judges can overrule legislators (or school board members) who trample on the rights of minorities. Too bad; that's the way our country is set up.

And at the moment that's no longer true, we cease to be Americans and become the subjects of a theocracy.

Leigh Williams

Austin, Texas

[Guest Guest]

During the office meeting, Paszkiewicz stated that he had been teaching using essentially the same methods for years.  There is no solid evidence other than that that could be used to support the assertion that "any reasonable person" would conclude that it was not new behavior.

This is one of the problems. Why was this teacher allowed to preach in that school for so long?

Your group is the religion of the future, forcing itself on the population through the courts, using the courts to twist the Constitution into funny balloon animals.

In what way is LeClair forcing a religion on anyone? The teacher lost control of his class, and was citing scripture and blatantly representing Darwin's theory. Religion, in the sense of whose variety, is a secondary issue here. The point is that, first, you have a plainly incompetent teacher supported in his incompetence by the school adminstration, and second that public schools are no place to be preaching a sectarian point of view.

The separation of church and state is not a "religion." In this country, the government is required to be neutral in matters of religion and to keep religious doctrine out of its official actions. That's our law not our religion, and it most definitely is embedded in our democracy.

If so-called Christians want to turn the country into a theocracy, then mobilize your forces and try to change the constitution. But don't sit there and lie about it. Among other things, lying is against your scriptures, which you claim to hold holy.

[Guest Watching From Afar]

During the office meeting, Paszkiewicz stated that he had been teaching using essentially the same methods for years.  There is no solid evidence other than that that could be used to support the assertion that "any reasonable person" would conclude that it was not new behavior.

This is one of the problems. Why was this teacher allowed to preach in that school for so long?

Your group is the religion of the future, forcing itself on the population through the courts, using the courts to twist the Constitution into funny balloon animals.

In what way is LeClair forcing a religion on anyone? The teacher lost control of his class, and was citing scripture and blatantly representing Darwin's theory. Religion, in the sense of whose variety, is a secondary issue here. The point is that, first, you have a plainly incompetent teacher supported in his incompetence by the school adminstration, and second that public schools are no place to be preaching a sectarian point of view.

The separation of church and state is not a "religion." In this country, the government is required to be neutral in matters of religion and to keep religious doctrine out of its official actions. That's our law not our religion, and it most definitely is embedded in our democracy.

If so-called Christians want to turn the country into a theocracy, then mobilize your forces and try to change the constitution. But don't sit there and lie about it. Among other things, lying is against your scriptures, which you claim to hold holy.

[Guest Patriot]

Bryan "metaphysics at some level" hardly equates to the blatant preaching of fundamentalist Christian doctrine in a classroom.

It's you who misunderstands the relationship between "the democratic process", by which I infer you mean "rule of the majority", and the Constitution.  You don't like it that judges can overrule legislators (or school board members) who trample on the rights of minorities.  Too bad; that's the way our country is set up. 

And at the moment that's no longer true, we cease to be Americans and become the subjects of a theocracy.

Leigh Williams

Austin, Texas

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"We cease to be Americans" ??? Really?? We become maybe, French ?? You really need to lay off the Kool-aid.

[Strife767]

He could be trying to bait you into revealing your identity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, I have that feeling too. Creepy people.

[an American in Texas]

"We cease to be Americans" ???  Really?? We become maybe, French ??  You really need to lay off the Kool-aid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Patrat, you don't have a clue what it means to be an American, do you? You know nothing about the foundational principles of this country. The "experiment in democracy" just passed you by, didn't it?

What I meant (as was clear to everyone with an IQ above that of brussels sprouts) was that we would lose that which makes us uniquely and proudly the American heirs of Washington, Franklin, Jefferson, and Madison.

I think you understand that, but couldn't resist the urge to make a D**bA** post using the word Koolaid.

You continue to be the most ironically named poster on the board, surpassing even 2smart4u.

Leigh

[Guest Paul]

"We cease to be Americans" ???  Really?? We become maybe, French ??  You really need to lay off the Kool-aid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think what Leigh means is that if everyone is not equal, then America is not true to its founding principles. It's obvious enough, unless you don't want to hear it.

I'm curious. Do you really think you're persuading anyone with the incessant references to Kool aid?

[Guest Paul]

Yeah, I have that feeling too. Creepy people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Being attuned to authoritarians, and many of them being authoritarians, they have to say something. Since they usually have nothing of merit to say, they make a great many inane remarks and insults. They've gotten used to it, to such a degree they probably believe they're making sense. Now that's creepy.

[Strife767]

"We cease to be Americans" ???   Really?? We become maybe, French ??  You really need to lay off the Kool-aid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"You eediot!"

[Guest Patriot]

Yeah, I have that feeling too. Creepy people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who's creepier than Paul ??

[Guest TheWholeTruth]

Who's creepier than Paul ??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That lying fraud private detective who spread all those bribes around kearny even after he left *** *** ***** ** *** ** *** ***** ** * ******** ********

KOTW Note: The above post was edited for content.

[Guest Guest]

No, sir or madam, you are the one who is not paying attention. Teacher discipline is not our issue. An apology is not our issue. Our issues are quality control and correction of false and inappropriate remarks. We have said that over and over again, and yet those who will support this teacher at all costs refuse to hear.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If Quality Control is what you say your issue is, then for many of us it has more than been resolved. You, on you and your son, have brought to light that this person did speak of religion in class. Granted everyone knows it. For many of us this issue has been addressed and unless you are still taping, there has been no new remarks from him that have made it public. Both his name and yours are throw through the mud here and it doesn't have to be that way. It does still sound like you want his head on a platter though? It is the ongoing circle of these web pages.

[Guest Guest]

Being attuned to authoritarians, and many of them being authoritarians, they have to say something. Since they usually have nothing of merit to say, they make a great many inane remarks and insults. They've gotten used to it, to such a degree they probably believe they're making sense. Now that's creepy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How pathetic is this site getting. Paul says something. Strife agrees with it saying how smart Paul is. Strife comments and then Paul responds. Leigh might chime in between posts agreeing with both of them and saying "good point" and then the circle begins again over and over and over. Three hundred sixty five days a year.

Years from now it will continue. Paul will say something. Strife will again agree saying how smart and correct Paul is. Strife then posts again responding telling why Paul’s comments are correct and then again Leigh will join in again. And the circle continues again.

Check for yourself at the posts. They claim it’s their duty to reply to the authoritarians. But in most of these topics they themselves are the authors. This was the subject stays alive but the same 3 or 4 people keep responding to endless nausea

[Strife767]

Who's creepier than Paul ??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Uh, you, for one. Mr. "break his backside" creeps me out too, not to mention the people that comment was originally directed at.

[Guest Patriot]

Patrat, you don't have a clue what it means to be an American, do you?  You know nothing about the foundational principles of this country.  The "experiment in democracy" just passed you by, didn't it?

What I meant (as was clear to everyone with an IQ above that of brussels sprouts) was that we would lose that which makes us uniquely and proudly the American heirs of Washington, Franklin, Jefferson, and Madison.

I think you understand that, but couldn't resist the urge to make a D**bA** post using the word Koolaid.

You continue to be the most ironically named poster on the board, surpassing even 2smart4u.

Leigh

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"Uniquely and proudly the American heirs of Washington, Franklin, Jefferson and Madison" ??? Really ??? I wonder what those gentlemen would think of you, Paul, Strife and a few other liberal pukes welcoming the ACLU with open arms, denying God, criticizing our President and wanting to cut and run in the Middle East ??? I think those American heros would line you up in front of a firing squad.

[Guest Supporter]

"We cease to be Americans" ???  Really?? We become maybe, French ??  You really need to lay off the Kool-aid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...using the term "Kool-Aid"doesn't make your argument a good one. And neither does turning a reasonable statement into something preposterous. Are you by any chance related to Amelia Bedilia? Because you seem to be taking some things too literally...

[Guest Supporter]

"We cease to be Americans" ???  Really?? We become maybe, French ??  You really need to lay off the Kool-aid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...using the term "Kool-Aid"doesn't make your argument a good one. And neither does turning a reasonable statement into something preposterous. Are you by any chance related to Amelia Bedilia? Because you seem to be taking some things too literally...

[Guest Supporter]

Who's creepier than Paul ??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You, every since you began using the term "Kool-Aid."

[Guest Guest]

Who's creepier than Paul ??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is this four-month long discussion finally at an end? Most of the discussion has been over an inane attempt to defend the indefensible conduct of a proselytizing zealot who was trying to shove his religious beliefs down the throats of other people's kids, uninvited. There have been some hot tempers on both sides, but by far the vast majority of the stupid and childish attacks have come from the side trying to defend the teacher. Their main line of attack, when it was obvious even to them that Paszkiewicz's conduct was indefensible, was to try to shift the discussion onto something else --- anything else, as long as they thought it shifted the focus. Because what these zealous fundies don't realize is that they're really trying to convince themselves, and to shield themselves from the world as it actually is. They can't live in a world of uncertainty, but the world is uncertain is many ways --- so they do what they think they have to do and make up a world that doesn't exist, a world where every moral choice is absolutely black and white and everything that doesn't fit into the little desktop mold they've made of the world is to be ignored and forgotten. "Please, please," they beg, "you must see things our way, you must!" because if anyone doesn't see it their way, they just might get a glimpse of the truth, and they don't want it.

Civilization has never advanced along the lines of these know-nothings, and it never will. Every age has seen its share of small-minded people, people without curiosity and without the humility and sense of wonder to realize that human beings came into the world knowing only a tiny part of the reality of all things, and that we learn more about reality by hard work, a little piece at a time --- not by declaring against all the evidence that the whole truth is written down in a collection of ancient writings that must never be questioned. We do not learn about reality by making up and closing our minds about it without even looking at the evidence all around us and thinking long and hard about what the evidence means. Every age has had its witch burners, its book burners and those who persecuted anyone who had an idea or acted in a way that threatened their comfort zone. The small-minded bigots who have posted in defense of their fellow small-minded bigot are no different. Invariably, their effort turns to hypocrisy and intellectual and moral dishonesty, as it has here. It's just the same thing in this place on a new day.

How fitting it is that this so-called "patriot" has nothing better and nothing more to say than a childish, four-word "gotcha" that a second-grader might utter on a school playground. In the end, that is all Paszkiewicz's defenders have to say.

For the rest of us, I hope we have learned something. I hope we have learned that citizenship means acting in defense of our country and its principles, both legal and ethical. I hope we have learned the value of taking a stand against wrongdoing when a person sees wrongdoing. This may have been a difficult time for Matthew LaClair and his family, but he and they will know all their lives that they did the right thing, something no other student was willing and able to do in the fifteen years that this abusive teacher has been at Kearny High. Many of Matthew's classmates will begin to realize this as they grow older. I hope they will have the courage and integrity to reach out to him and acknowledge their realization that he did the right thing while they remained silent, and that in a very real sense, although they did not realize it or would not admit it at the time, he spoke for them.

For the Kearny community, I hope this will be a lesson that will draw the community together by lifting it up to a higher moral ground. That remains to be seen. The fact that Paszkiewicz has been allowed to continue teaching without even being suspended is troubling. The obligation to ensure that our country's most fundamental law and the educational system are taken seriously rests with the Board of Education and the administrators throughout the Kearny school system. I hope they will rise to the challenge, but so far I see no evidence that they will.

So what do we do next?

[Guest Patriot]

Is this four-month long discussion finally at an end? Most of the discussion has been over an inane attempt to defend the indefensible conduct of a proselytizing zealot who was trying to shove his religious beliefs down the throats of other people's kids, uninvited. There have been some hot tempers on both sides, but by far the vast majority of the stupid and childish attacks have come from the side trying to defend the teacher. Their main line of attack, when it was obvious even to them that Paszkiewicz's conduct was indefensible, was to try to shift the discussion onto something else --- anything else, as long as they thought it shifted the focus. Because what these zealous fundies don't realize is that they're really trying to convince themselves, and to shield themselves from the world as it actually is. They can't live in a world of uncertainty, but the world is uncertain is many ways --- so they do what they think they have to do and make up a world that doesn't exist, a world where every moral choice is absolutely black and white and everything that doesn't fit into the little desktop mold they've made of the world is to be ignored and forgotten. "Please, please," they beg, "you must see things our way, you must!" because if anyone doesn't see it their way, they just might get a glimpse of the truth, and they don't want it.

Civilization has never advanced along the lines of these know-nothings, and it never will. Every age has seen its share of small-minded people, people without curiosity and without the humility and sense of wonder to realize that human beings came into the world knowing only a tiny part of the reality of all things, and that we learn more about reality by hard work, a little piece at a time --- not by declaring against all the evidence that the whole truth is written down in a collection of ancient writings that must never be questioned. We do not learn about reality by making up and closing our minds about it without even looking at the evidence all around us and thinking long and hard about what the evidence means. Every age has had its witch burners, its book burners and those who persecuted anyone who had an idea or acted in a way that threatened their comfort zone. The small-minded bigots who have posted in defense of their fellow small-minded bigot are no different. Invariably, their effort turns to hypocrisy and intellectual and moral dishonesty, as it has here. It's just the same thing in this place on a new day.

How fitting it is that this so-called "patriot" has nothing better and nothing more to say than a childish, four-word "gotcha" that a second-grader might utter on a school playground. In the end, that is all Paszkiewicz's defenders have to say.

For the rest of us, I hope we have learned something. I hope we have learned that citizenship means acting in defense of our country and its principles, both legal and ethical. I hope we have learned the value of taking a stand against wrongdoing when a person sees wrongdoing. This may have been a difficult time for Matthew LaClair and his family, but he and they will know all their lives that they did the right thing, something no other student was willing and able to do in the fifteen years that this abusive teacher has been at Kearny High. Many of Matthew's classmates will begin to realize this as they grow older. I hope they will have the courage and integrity to reach out to him and acknowledge their realization that he did the right thing while they remained silent, and that in a very real sense, although they did not realize it or would not admit it at the time, he spoke for them.

For the Kearny community, I hope this will be a lesson that will draw the community together by lifting it up to a higher moral ground. That remains to be seen. The fact that Paszkiewicz has been allowed to continue teaching without even being suspended is troubling. The obligation to ensure that our country's most fundamental law and the educational system are taken seriously rests with the Board of Education and the administrators throughout the Kearny school system. I hope they will rise to the challenge, but so far I see no evidence that they will.

So what do we do next?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The real question here is why has Paul signed his name to this post as "Guest" ??

[Guest Guest]

Is this four-month long discussion finally at an end? Most of the discussion has been over an inane attempt to defend the indefensible conduct of a proselytizing zealot who was trying to shove his religious beliefs down the throats of other people's kids, uninvited. There have been some hot tempers on both sides, but by far the vast majority of the stupid and childish attacks have come from the side trying to defend the teacher. Their main line of attack, when it was obvious even to them that Paszkiewicz's conduct was indefensible, was to try to shift the discussion onto something else --- anything else, as long as they thought it shifted the focus. Because what these zealous fundies don't realize is that they're really trying to convince themselves, and to shield themselves from the world as it actually is. They can't live in a world of uncertainty, but the world is uncertain is many ways --- so they do what they think they have to do and make up a world that doesn't exist, a world where every moral choice is absolutely black and white and everything that doesn't fit into the little desktop mold they've made of the world is to be ignored and forgotten. "Please, please," they beg, "you must see things our way, you must!" because if anyone doesn't see it their way, they just might get a glimpse of the truth, and they don't want it.

Civilization has never advanced along the lines of these know-nothings, and it never will. Every age has seen its share of small-minded people, people without curiosity and without the humility and sense of wonder to realize that human beings came into the world knowing only a tiny part of the reality of all things, and that we learn more about reality by hard work, a little piece at a time --- not by declaring against all the evidence that the whole truth is written down in a collection of ancient writings that must never be questioned. We do not learn about reality by making up and closing our minds about it without even looking at the evidence all around us and thinking long and hard about what the evidence means. Every age has had its witch burners, its book burners and those who persecuted anyone who had an idea or acted in a way that threatened their comfort zone. The small-minded bigots who have posted in defense of their fellow small-minded bigot are no different. Invariably, their effort turns to hypocrisy and intellectual and moral dishonesty, as it has here. It's just the same thing in this place on a new day.

How fitting it is that this so-called "patriot" has nothing better and nothing more to say than a childish, four-word "gotcha" that a second-grader might utter on a school playground. In the end, that is all Paszkiewicz's defenders have to say.

For the rest of us, I hope we have learned something. I hope we have learned that citizenship means acting in defense of our country and its principles, both legal and ethical. I hope we have learned the value of taking a stand against wrongdoing when a person sees wrongdoing. This may have been a difficult time for Matthew LaClair and his family, but he and they will know all their lives that they did the right thing, something no other student was willing and able to do in the fifteen years that this abusive teacher has been at Kearny High. Many of Matthew's classmates will begin to realize this as they grow older. I hope they will have the courage and integrity to reach out to him and acknowledge their realization that he did the right thing while they remained silent, and that in a very real sense, although they did not realize it or would not admit it at the time, he spoke for them.

For the Kearny community, I hope this will be a lesson that will draw the community together by lifting it up to a higher moral ground. That remains to be seen. The fact that Paszkiewicz has been allowed to continue teaching without even being suspended is troubling. The obligation to ensure that our country's most fundamental law and the educational system are taken seriously rests with the Board of Education and the administrators throughout the Kearny school system. I hope they will rise to the challenge, but so far I see no evidence that they will.

So what do we do next?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

WOW !!!! Spoken like a true LaClair. They couldn't have said it better if they wrote this themselves.

[Guest Guest]

If Quality Control is what you say your issue is, then for many of us it has more than been resolved.  You, on you and your son,  have brought to light that this person did speak of religion in class. Granted everyone knows it.  For many of us this issue has been addressed and unless you are still taping, there has been no new remarks from him that have made it public.  Both his name and yours are throw through the mud here and it doesn't have to be that way.  It does still sound like you want his head on a platter though? It is the ongoing circle of these web pages.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But for some the issue is obviously not resolved. Many of the students don't have a clue about the Constitution, or about science. Some of the teachers don't have a clue either. That is why they must be educated, and why this matter should not be allowed to rest until they are.

Many of the people who keep crying very loudly that it's over are the ones who are actually keeping it alive. They want it to go away without anyone admitting their mistakes and correcting them. That would send all the wrong messages, and would leave important things undone.

Throwing mud at a student is not the answer, and it isn't appropriate. No one is asking for the teacher's head on a platter, but he should have admitted his wrongdoing instead of trying to defend it, and apologized. He has not.

[Guest Guest]

How pathetic is this site getting. Paul says something. Strife agrees with it saying how smart Paul is.  Strife comments and then Paul responds. Leigh might chime in between posts agreeing with both of them and saying "good point" and then the circle begins again over and over and over. Three hundred sixty five days a year. 

Years from now it will continue. Paul will say something. Strife will again agree saying how smart and correct Paul is. Strife then posts again responding telling why Paul’s comments are correct and then again Leigh will join in again. And the circle continues again.

Check for yourself at the posts. They claim it’s their duty to reply to the authoritarians. But in most of these topics they themselves are the authors.  This was the subject stays alive but the same 3 or 4 people keep responding to endless nausea

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The difference is that Paul, Strife, Leigh, oneellama and others on the LaClair side actually say something. Read your post. You're not saying anything.

[Guest Guest]

"Uniquely and proudly the American heirs of Washington, Franklin, Jefferson and Madison" ??? Really ???  I wonder what those gentlemen would think of you, Paul, Strife and a few other liberal pukes welcoming the ACLU with open arms, denying God, criticizing our President and wanting to cut and run in the Middle East ???  I think those American heros would line you up in front of a firing squad.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, you would think that. You're way of "thinking" is disgusting, and there's nothing patriotic about it.

[ElneClare]

So what do we do next?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We can only continue to bring to light such violations of the U.S Constitution, as Matthew Le Clair did. And Hopefully the judges in our court system will continue to add to the understanding of the First Amendment and the Establishment Cause to protect the Separation of Church and State.

While some may claim that the majority wants America to be a Christian Nation, I for one will fight for our Right of Religious Freedom, by making sure the Government does not endorse one Faith over any Others even those that have No Beliefs.

Yes that a lot of words Capitalized, but it is as close as I'll get to shouting on the internet. Not upholding the Constitution, as the Law of the United States of America is the worst wrong we could give our children.