[LaClair in News Again]

Kearny student sees bias in high school textbook

After a period of late night assaults on the university campus, the local interfaith alliance decided to get involved. It was decided that they would investigate. A liberal minister visited the campus, and after a thorough search only one problem was identified. It was in fact one of the campus security phones that was not working. The liberal minister wrote a detailed report blaming the administration for failed priorities and numerous accusations of financial mismanagement and corruption and posted it at the kiosk. Unfortunately, soon after, there was another attack.

The local interfaith alliance was concerned and embarrassed, so they sent their most conservative minister. After a thorough investigation, the conservative minister identified the same problem. The conservative minister ripped down the liberal minister’s report and threw it on the ground and replaced it with a simple to read sign that read: Out of Order. Unfortunately, there was yet another attack.

Finally, at a loss for a solution, the local interfaith alliance sent the humanist minister. Relying on the wisdom of several millenniums of religious teachings and holy books from every faith and the most obscure prophets, the humanist minister searched for answers, and then came upon the broken phone with the out of order sign.

The humanist minister looked down and read the words of the liberal minister and shook with disbelief. The humanist minister reached down picked up the now crumbled dissertation and decided to throw it away in a trash receptacle that had been conveniently placed nearby.

The humanist minister pondered the replacement sign left by the conservative minister. Seeing that there was plenty of room to write on the sign left by the conservative minister, the humanist minister took out a black magic marker and meticulously crossed out the words that had been left by the conservative minister so that none of the message remained. Then with the left over clean space that remained the meditation began in earnest. Next a flash of insight miraculously came and on the remaining space the humanist minister wrote in large letters with a big smile: KEEP RUNNING!

Everybody knows that college textbooks are routinely rewritten, edited and replaced. Furthermore, as any college student who has tried to sell their used books could tell you, earlier editions are nearly worthless.

Of course the guys who write textbooks are biased and of course 18 year olds are wildly idealistic and biased too.

Kearny should be proud of any youngster who has the courage to stand for factual integrity and truth, even if two years from now that truth is revealed to have been wrong or a mere superstition.

I am proud of Matthew LaClair.

[Student rights and community understanding]

Not counting the victimization of Paul and Matthew LaClair, of course.

Neither Paul nr Matt can be called proven sellers of religious extremism. There are no wildly successful humanist organizations.

The story is used to incite? Where and how?

The Middle East with weapons.

Huh? Who says?

The traditional doctrine is that Adam and Eve possessed heavenly access regardless of the reasoning you suggest above, and sin broke the relationship. The sufferings of Christ as far as I know are never referred to as providing the rationale for Christ's sacrifice (on the contrary, the plan of redemption is implied as an eternal expectation).

I will not dispute your understandings. I do not believe that a kind deity would require human sacrifice.

Were you ordained by the Universal Life church or what? What do they charge these days for the paperwork?

Nasty tone, but since you asked, I completed the master of humanist leadership studies at the Humanist Institute. The current tuition rates are available online.

The actual ordination was by recommendation and authorized by the American Humanist Association division of Humanist Certification

Heh. It's free these days!

http://www.themonastery.org/?destination=ordination

Ha Ha. ?

Neither does ethics in the sense you're apparently using the term.

Correct!

Including the theory that good science always hold the possibility that a new discover will prove or disprove an earlier theory?

Or does that not rise to the level of "theory" either?

Wow you got another idea correct!

This is why good science is often done by deeply religious people such as Gallileo and Newton.

So there's no use asking you about those great ideas, I suppose.

Wrong! (And you were on a roll.) Ask me anything you like

[An honest dialogue on religion]

Hi Paul,

You cannot get honest discussions because ultimately the issue is about the power of money and the ability to keep duping the public legally and profitably. Once they realize that a group or person can't be converted they have to demonize. Its like all the other political claptrap being promoted. People believe that the dems will end the occupations or that the reps will win the wars.

As Ghandi said " an eye for an eye leaves everyone blind."

There's a lot of that here.

The objective is to keep the government looking stupid and expensive so that all manners of real ripoffs can occur.

The same nastiness is on so many websites.

Keep on keeping on!

Your Friend,

Gene

Gene, your posts here inspired me to try this. It’s amazing what a little Faith can do.

My girlfriend of many years ago once told me about an experience she had with her father, who was a plumber by trade. As a teenager, while she was helping him with some work around the house, he said to her “hand me the female part.” Innocently, she asked “How do I know which one that is.” He replied “Look at them.” She was embarrassed, but she got the point instantly.

It’s endlessly fascinating that scriptural literalists never really look at the texts they claim to believe in. They’ll do what they call “Bible study” as a happy-happy, but if anyone really tries to discuss what the Bible, or the Koran, etc., actually says, self-styled “believers” will take offense and refuse to participate in the discussion. That’s why the self-proclaimed Christians who come to this page won’t get involved when someone opens a topic for honest discussion about the Bible. See, for example: http://forums.kearnyontheweb.com/index.php?showtopic=24653

There was at least one older topic on this subject, but those archives appear to have been deleted.

There’s much to be said for mutual and community support, but when it becomes denial, it ceases being religious and becomes anti-religious. It no longer gets people on the straight and narrow path of righteous behavior; just the opposite, it gives them license to justify anything, making them self-righteous instead of righteous. Many of the most fervent religious zealots see themselves as the only moral people in the world; truth is, their behavior is often destructive, unethical and immoral, and it’s a direct result of their belief system, the way it cuts them off from others, and their refusal to hold themselves accountable. Their belief system systematically trains them to do it that way. In such belief systems, truth is not the highest ideal; the highest ideal is defending one’s beliefs as ultimate truth.

Increasingly over the past few years, I have come to the view of Sam Harris (The End of Faith) and my friend Austin Dacey (The Secular Conscience: Why Belief Belongs in Public Life) that we must end what Dacey calls the Privacy Fallacy – the mistaken notion that criticism of religious doctrines and beliefs is out of bounds. The religious right is correct in observing that laws and society are not possible without moral and ethical foundations. They cannot have it both ways. When they offer their religious beliefs as moral foundations for us all, they are fair game. The same is true of any theist who offers his religion for public consumption among friends, but doesn’t really want to hear their response, except in the form of a happy-happy. They're not looking for truth, they're desperately seeking support.

Some of my most painful experiences have been the inability to reach people because religious dogmas got in the way. Felix Adler, who founded Ethical Culture, identified separation/alienation as one of the three fundamental sources of human anguish. Even my “relationship” with David Paszkiewicz, with whom I’ve never spoken more than a few words, is deeply unsatisfying. There is no excuse for two people of good will to allow things to remain as they are between the two of us. If one takes that as true, there are only a few viable conclusions to draw, perhaps only one.

If fundamentalists and literalists from all religions really looked at their scriptures, themselves and their behavior honestly, they would see this. If they would only listen openly and honestly for an hour to someone who sees the problems with various theistic doctrines, scriptures, etc., they would see what my friend saw; I say “would” and not “might” because if they really looked, they would see. The thing identifies itself, but anyone who refuses to look at it cannot see it, and we live in a culture that not only tells them “that’s OK,” but affirmatively encourages it; and not only that, but puts the hammer down on anyone who would challenge that way of doing things. This video does a superb job making the point:

Might we have a real dialogue this time?

[Student rights and community understanding]

Hi Paul,

Thanks for your kind words.

The saddest truth is that victimization and martydom are proven sellers of religious extremism. There is no archeological evidence that proves Moses or his people were slaves in Egypt yet that story is used to incite. It is the undergirding of Christianity that god needed to experience the pain and death of his only child in order to be convinced that humankind was worthy of heavenly access. And of course there's the one about those virgins you get in heaven when you kill infidels. (I hope that this is true and that the virgins are 90 year old nuns.)

Creationism does not rise to the level of theory. Good science always holds the possibility that a new discovery will prove or disprove an earlier theory.

I have a peculiar notion that it might take something like making great Humanists like Reverend Ross Henry or Robert Tapp face lions at the Meadowlands in order to get the word out about the great ideas of humanism.

Warmest regards to the LaClaire family,

Gene

Last evening I attended meet-the-candidates night at Garfield School. Four of the five Board candidates were there, all except Ms. Santos. I asked some questions, and I believe Mr. Paszkiewicz, who was also there, asked a question.

I cannot be certain Mr. Paszkiewicz asked this question, but he did fill out a card, and I presume that he did ask this. He stated that three Christian students’ rights have recently been violated. One was a student who was not allowed to pray at lunch (I think it was lunch). Another was a student whose letter to the troops was censored because it contained a Christian reference. I do not recall the third incident, but it was of a similar character.

Mr. Paszkiewicz’s question for the Board members was whether the teachers are now fearful because of what happened in his case, and are over-reacting. If they are, they have no reason to be.

The problem, if there is one, is not fear, but misunderstanding. The legal distinction is abundantly clear. That was the purpose of the ADL training. The students may express their religious views in school. Teachers and other school employees and officials are restricted.

If any of these incidents occurred, it was wrong. The students should have been allowed to express themselves.

You may notice that we have not protested the formation of the Christian club at the high school, advised by Mr. Paszkiewicz. That is because as far as we know the club is operating within the law. As long as it does so, it will have only our good wishes.

It is a pity that Mr. Paszkiewicz and his supporters refuse to make any attempt to speak with me. There is room for common ground. Had he, or any of these students, come to me, I would have defended their right to express themselves as vigorously as I pressed the case that Mr. Paszkiewicz was out of line.

I am very sorry that the incident struck some raw nerves, and opened wounds that apparently will not heal, but it is time to get past it and look for common ground. I considered this to be a moral obligation when I was a practicing Christian, and I still do, no less now than then. Misunderstanding persists because one side refuses to talk to the other.

So I take this opportunity again to invite a dialogue between the opposing sides. My number is in the book, and Mr. Paszkiewicz has my permission to send a note to Matthew, who is in school every day, through the office of the principal or the guidance counselor. Actually, he doesn’t need my permission, because Matthew is now eighteen.

I take this opportunity also to welcome my friend Gene Queval to KOTW. He is a marvelous man with an enormous heart and a terrific sense of humor. Thank you for your post, Gene, and welcome.

[Mr. P: "There WERE dinosaurs on Noah's Ark"]

I'd be interested in hearing what ethical system you use from which to condemn slavery. And then I'd be interested in hearing whether or not you are a determinist/compatibilist.

Hi Bryan,

I am not inclined to be absolute in my thinking but I guess that any of the various versions of "The golden rule" would be the source of my ethical musings on slavery. As to the next question, I behave as if I have free will especially when the stakes seem low, and/or I have time to deliberate. I cannot exercise free will when reflexive action occurs. (I am thinking here about the hammer on the knee type of reflex.) Certain split second decisions may apply also.

Warmest regards,

Gene

[Mr. P: "There WERE dinosaurs on Noah's Ark"]

If I were inclined to believe in an opinionated supreme being, I would view the fossil record as the more perfect "word of god" rather than the man-made, edited, politically motivated literature of the antique scriptures. Many of those words and ideas will go the way of slavery: a superstition that is an embarrassment we have inherited from ignorant ancestors. Any god that values human sacrifice through painful martyrdom is impotent and does not reflect humanistic values. I am inspired by the divine within unique individuals.

Reverend Gene Queval Humanist Minister

Hamilton, New Jersey

"There never was in the world two opinions alike, no more than two hairs or two grains. The most universal quality is diversity. "

Michel Eyquem De Montaigne