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God Save Us From Christians

School Board takes new Steps

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So the response to having a teacher's wrongdoings exposed is... to make sure no student is in a position to expose such wrongdoing in the future?

This is a "shoot the messenger" solution, quite transparently. If you don't like what the media's reporting, then by golly, condemn the media! It's a DODGE, folks. They don't want their dirty laundy waved around in public, so they try to suppress the means of exposing it.

This rule does NOTHING to correct the far more serious problem of classroom preaching... it just tries to make sure nobody hears about it in future. That's just as cowardly and dishonest when a local school board does it, as when a president does it.

Hey guess what! There will be a new policy and you can't do anything about!!!!

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It isn't. These people are just plain lying. They want this to protect the misdeeds of Paszkiewicz and his ilk, not the students, and not the parents. They want it because it will partly negate the LaClair's partial win (the new policy and staff training) by simultaneously taking something away. They want to ensure that, should this happen again, the preacher/teacher can get away with it next time.

Of course, this could come back to bite them should some teacher improperly teach some other thing, antisemitism, for example. Perhaps they're counting on the school board and administration being very selective with enforcement.

Do you know what? Unless you go to a BOE meeting and voice your concerns, and tell the parents who requested this new policy that they are all liars, you're not going to win this one!

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My guess is that you didn't comprehend the scenario. Who is talking about the teacher controversy?

How naive do you think we are? What a grand coincidence it would be for a policy being proposed to ban audio recording of classes directly on the heels of a situation where a teacher was caught/proven to be doing wrong solely because of an audio recording, with the two being completely unrelated!

Come on, now, honestly. Do you seriously contend that it's a total coincidence?

It's water under the bridge, it's over. Get with the program.

Are you willing to hang your child out to dry so you an humiliate another child for being racist?

Are you able to explain how any student/teacher who is recorded doing nothing wrong would be harmed in any way from being recorded while in the process of 'catching' someone else doing something wrong?

And, with approximately 20 students per class, don't you think at least two are needed to tell thier parents about any unappropriate remarks from a teacher?

Not if either of them has irrefutable proof, like an audio recording.

Now, you do realize that you just suggested that Paszkiewicz shouldn't have gotten caught? It was in fact only one student in that class who had a complaint, despite the blatant nature of Paszkiewicz's wrongdoing.

They would be at the BOE in a second.  You won't need a recording.

What if only one student has the guts to complain, as we JUST saw happen? Do you even realize what you're saying?

Not only does allowing audio recordings, covert or not, during classtime, protect students from a teacher like Paszkiewicz who is popular and/or has students who don't care that he's not supposed to be preaching, but are just happy that he's spending class time in a way that lessens their overall workload (believe me, high school kids (having been one and having friends that age then and now) love it when teachers go off-topic or on tangents, because that's less notes to take, less stuff to study for, etc. I'm sure many students ignored Paszkiewicz's preaching, if not for fear of confronting him, then just putting a higher priority on not working than on pointing out that he shouldn't be talking about the stuff he was)...

It can also protect a teacher who is falsely accused of sexually harassing a student, for example. More than one teacher has lost his job because one or some girl(s) who didn't like the grade they got made up a story that was later proven false, but only after it destroyed his career.

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Can you imagine a student approaching a teacher and saying, "I think you are doing something illegal.  May I record you to prove that you are breaking the law?

The teacher will either refuse permission or allow the recordings but making sure he doesn't say anything he shouldn't.  Pure idiocy.

Nope, I can't imagine a student going up to the teacher and saying that. But I can imagine a parent doing it. :rolleyes:

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Nope, I can't imagine a student going up to the teacher and saying that. But I can imagine a parent doing it.  :rolleyes:

The problem is that the teacher could just not do whatever it is they're being accused of doing while they're being recorded, then start again when they know they aren't.

A student's right to record another student's or a teacher's speech during class time is important, as shown recently. If it's (recording, that is) done for no good reason and with malicious intent, that should be dealt with appropriately of course, but banning all recording is not the answer.

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So how do you propose to prevent a teenager from embarrassing himself or herself by running through the woods naked at a beer party? The remedy you propose is worse than the potential offense. No one is more than tangentially interested in what the students said, and no one outside Kearny can even identify them. The likelihood of any student suffering harm from being recorded in class is remote at best. The likelihood of a student being harmed by a bad teacher he has no means of outing is substantial, as proved by this case.

you are definetely Paul LaClair... :rolleyes:

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Nope, I can't imagine a student going up to the teacher and saying that. But I can imagine a parent doing it.  :blink:

A parent would have to be a fool to think that a teacher breaking policy would approve of their taping. If the teacher is then knowingly being recorded and then breaks policy he would have to be an idiot.

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you are definetely Paul LaClair... :blink:

I appreciate the compliment, and the admission by silence that you have no response to the content of my post. However, contrary to what you seem to think, Mr. LaClair is not the only person capable of putting together a coherent argument in complete sentences. Having read the posts of those supporting Paszkiewicz, I can understand why you might think otherwise.

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Maybe beause he has done that before.  :blink:  :)

I remember him posting once (twice?) under Matthew's login by accident, and making a follow-up post shortly after to correct himself.

But I'd like to see an example of him, after having registered, having posted as a guest on purpose to hide his identity.

If he wanted to do that, why would he register in the first place? This is just conspiracy theory.

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I remember him posting once (twice?) under Matthew's login by accident, and making a follow-up post shortly after to correct himself.

But I'd like to see an example of him, after having registered, having posted as a guest on purpose to hide his identity.

If he wanted to do that, why would he register in the first place? This is just conspiracy theory.

I guarantee if Mr.P. would have done that you would have the man crucified here.

True??? :wub:

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I guarantee if Mr.P. would have done that you would have the man crucified here.

True??? :wub:

And I guarantee that if Mr. P had announced his conversion to Islam, you would've called him a big stinky doodyhead.

See how much fun it is to speculate on stuff that never happened?

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And I guarantee that if Mr. P had announced his conversion to Islam, you would've called him a big stinky doodyhead.

See how much fun it is to speculate on stuff that never happened?

"doodyhead" ?? Is that a technical term ??

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I remember him posting once (twice?) under Matthew's login by accident, and making a follow-up post shortly after to correct himself.

But I'd like to see an example of him, after having registered, having posted as a guest on purpose to hide his identity.

If he wanted to do that, why would he register in the first place? This is just conspiracy theory.

Strife, you are so stupid! There is no way to know if he had posted as a guess on purpose to hide his identity. Although I have no though that he would do it. Someone who trains his child to secretely record a class can secretely send messages here... :(

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:D

How naive do you think we are? What a grand coincidence it would be for a policy being proposed to ban audio recording of classes directly on the heels of a situation where a teacher was caught/proven to be doing wrong solely because of an audio recording, with the two being completely unrelated!

Come on, now, honestly. Do you seriously contend that it's a total coincidence?

Are you able to explain how any student/teacher who is recorded doing nothing wrong would be harmed in any way from being recorded while in the process of 'catching' someone else doing something wrong?

Not if either of them has irrefutable proof, like an audio recording.

Now, you do realize that you just suggested that Paszkiewicz shouldn't have gotten caught? It was in fact only one student in that class who had a complaint, despite the blatant nature of Paszkiewicz's wrongdoing.

What if only one student has the guts to complain, as we JUST saw happen? Do you even realize what you're saying?

Not only does allowing audio recordings, covert or not, during classtime, protect students from a teacher like Paszkiewicz who is popular and/or has students who don't care that he's not supposed to be preaching, but are just happy that he's spending class time in a way that lessens their overall workload (believe me, high school kids (having been one and having friends that age then and now) love it when teachers go off-topic or on tangents, because that's less notes to take, less stuff to study for, etc. I'm sure many students ignored Paszkiewicz's preaching, if not for fear of confronting him, then just putting a higher priority on not working than on pointing out that he shouldn't be talking about the stuff he was)...

It can also protect a teacher who is falsely accused of sexually harassing a student, for example. More than one teacher has lost his job because one or some girl(s) who didn't like the grade they got made up a story that was later proven false, but only after it destroyed his career.

blah blah blah blah blah :(

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Strife, you are so stupid! There is no way to know if he had posted as a guess on purpose to hide his identity. Although I have no though that he would do it. Someone who trains his child to secretely record a class can secretely send messages here... :(

that was doubt*...sorry about that!

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Strife, you are so stupid! There is no way to know if he had posted as a guess on purpose to hide his identity. Although I have no though that he would do it. Someone who trains his child to secretely record a class can secretely send messages here... :P

Gosh, I had no idea he was so deviously powerful. Be careful what you say about him--he can probably see you when you're sleeping and know when you're awake....

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Strife, you are so stupid!

The irony of this statement is about to make itself very clear. Stay tuned...

There is no way to know if he had posted as a guess on purpose to hide his identity.

Exactly! But that didn't stop you from asserting that he did. Thanks for admitting your dishonesty. :P

Although I have no doubt {fixed by Strife767} that he would do it.

Based on what? Only your preconceptions. Paul has been caught doing nothing dishonest at all, so saying that you have no doubt that he would do something dishonest only shows irrational you are.

Someone who trains his child to secretely record a class

Not wasting any more time before lying again, huh? But I'll give you a chance--can you prove this allegation?

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Please tell me you live in Kearny. *chuckles*

I can't say that I do, Strife, and in a way I'm glad I'm not because I'm not in a hurry to move to a community where I could (very potentially) get persecuted and receive death threats for standing up for civil rights. Once the fundamentalists saw my atheist bumpersticker, or saw me wearing my atheists in foxholes sweatshirt, for example, I have little doubt that I would suffer the same discrimination as the LeClair family has. Also, taking into consideration all these ad hominem attacks that have been baselessly hurled against you in this forum, it evinces how welcome someone in your community might be that rejects ancient religious dogma. My hat is totally off to you for handling all those ad hominem attacks in such a dignified and respectable way. Keep up the good work!

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Prohibiting students from recording their classes is a bad idea for many reasons.

1. Some students find recordings useful. This isn't limited to those classified as disabled under the law. Recordings are valuable educational tools for some students. Taking that tool away is wrong. It's like using a meat axe to remove a sliver.

I wanted to briefly address this point. I raised the same issue in the other thread under messages of support for Matthew. I completely agree with the argument that is made above. In my educational experience, as classes progressively became more intricate and detailed in terms of content and complexity, the demand also rises to spend more time outside of class studying the content of lecture notes, handouts, and textbooks at greater length to increase comprehension of what you're supposed to be learning. Once I began to record lectures, it provided me with another resource, in addition to the others, that not only enhanced my education, but it resulted in more A's. The ability to go back and review parts of lectures that are complex gave me the opportunity to better understand what I was learning.

Don't take it just from me, folks. Professor Claude W. Olney, J.D, who teaches at Arizona State, also encouraged students to consider tape recording lectures.

Oh by the way, Prof. Olney, for those who don't know who he is, was the author of the benchmark series "Where There's A Will, There's An A: How to Get Better Grades In High School."

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The irony of this statement is about to make itself very clear. Stay tuned...

Exactly! But that didn't stop you from asserting that he did. Thanks for admitting your dishonesty. :lol:

Based on what? Only your preconceptions. Paul has been caught doing nothing dishonest at all, so saying that you have no doubt that he would do something dishonest only shows irrational you are.

Not wasting any more time before lying again, huh? But I'll give you a chance--can you prove this allegation?

prove what that matthew secretely recorded a class???? Are you kidding me?Have you been reading the newspaper lately?

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