HFD

[doc13mets]

One thing is certain the Harrison FD’s days are numbered. It’s really sad. They were a great department and still to this day have a number of great firefighters. Unfortunately the economy has shifted and the town continues to make cuts across the board. The FD being one of the biggest line items gets cut multiple times a year. Harrison is not safe without a fully funded/paid fire department. Harrison residents deserve and need at least 1 Engine, 1 Ladder and 2 EMS crews protecting them at all times. They are a service orientated department and do a lot more than just fight fires.

I keep hearing about how health insurance costs are going to skyrocket and a number of guys will retire and there is no plan to replace any of them.

They need to be replaced somehow and someway and volunteers in Harrison aren’t the simple answer. It’s not an overnight process.

One thing I’ve learned in my West Hudson days is that East Newark provides similar services to Harrison except cheaper. Think about their respective police departments. Do you feel safer with 2 cops always on duty in a .1 square mile town, yes POINT ONE (that’s one tenth of a square mile for our Harrison High graduates). Relax the Harrison High comment was a joke, now back to business. Or do you feel safer in Harrison with the 2-3 patrol officers on duty? I’ll take East Newark any day of the week. Both are paid police departments that offer the same service. See what I mean? Ok so here it is. I’m not saying Harrison should merge with East Newark for fire protection services, but I believe they should consider contracting them to offer a fully paid engine or ladder company to supplement the retirees that they will not replace. Harrison would pay a lump sum to East Newark to offer this protection. (It’s not unheard of tons of towns all over the country are contracting their neighbors to offer fire protection) With this lump sum (which would be lower then what Harrison would pay for a fully manned engine company) East Newark could hire and staff one company 24/7. East Newark would benefit because they could make some money off the deal (as they would pay substantially lower salaries than Harrison, an example ENPD vs HPD salaries) and save Harrison money at the same time. Also you get local residents who care about the communities and still live around here to be paid firefighters, who could also be volunteers still in their off duty hours.

No service reduction would happen in fact coverage would increase at a lower cost then what it is today.

The end result would be keeping HFD running out of one station with EMS and say a Ladder and East Newark paid guys running out of their HQ or Cleveland Ave. They would be automatically responding to any call in Harrison as that’s what they are contracted to do.

This is not a suggestion to replace any Harrison Firefighters job, nor a plan to replace the paid guys with volunteers. This is merely a suggestion to increase the amount of paid firefighters in the area and at a substantially lower cost.

[Guest Harrison's Bravest]

One thing is certain the Harrison FD’s days are numbered. It’s really sad. They were a great department and still to this day have a number of great firefighters. Unfortunately the economy has shifted and the town continues to make cuts across the board. The FD being one of the biggest line items gets cut multiple times a year. Harrison is not safe without a fully funded/paid fire department. Harrison residents deserve and need at least 1 Engine, 1 Ladder and 2 EMS crews protecting them at all times. They are a service orientated department and do a lot more than just fight fires.

I keep hearing about how health insurance costs are going to skyrocket and a number of guys will retire and there is no plan to replace any of them.

They need to be replaced somehow and someway and volunteers in Harrison aren’t the simple answer. It’s not an overnight process.

One thing I’ve learned in my West Hudson days is that East Newark provides similar services to Harrison except cheaper. Think about their respective police departments. Do you feel safer with 2 cops always on duty in a .1 square mile town, yes POINT ONE (that’s one tenth of a square mile for our Harrison High graduates). Relax the Harrison High comment was a joke, now back to business. Or do you feel safer in Harrison with the 2-3 patrol officers on duty? I’ll take East Newark any day of the week. Both are paid police departments that offer the same service. See what I mean? Ok so here it is. I’m not saying Harrison should merge with East Newark for fire protection services, but I believe they should consider contracting them to offer a fully paid engine or ladder company to supplement the retirees that they will not replace. Harrison would pay a lump sum to East Newark to offer this protection. (It’s not unheard of tons of towns all over the country are contracting their neighbors to offer fire protection) With this lump sum (which would be lower then what Harrison would pay for a fully manned engine company) East Newark could hire and staff one company 24/7. East Newark would benefit because they could make some money off the deal (as they would pay substantially lower salaries than Harrison, an example ENPD vs HPD salaries) and save Harrison money at the same time. Also you get local residents who care about the communities and still live around here to be paid firefighters, who could also be volunteers still in their off duty hours.

No service reduction would happen in fact coverage would increase at a lower cost then what it is today.

The end result would be keeping HFD running out of one station with EMS and say a Ladder and East Newark paid guys running out of their HQ or Cleveland Ave. They would be automatically responding to any call in Harrison as that’s what they are contracted to do.

This is not a suggestion to replace any Harrison Firefighters job, nor a plan to replace the paid guys with volunteers. This is merely a suggestion to increase the amount of paid firefighters in the area and at a substantially lower cost.

Hey Doc, I think you need to stick to what you know best, flipping burgers.

[Guest Guest]

Why so quick to dump on Doc13mets? He had previously been praised by the FF faithfull for defending them on certain issues. Now the man offers what seems to be a viable solution to the inevitable breakdown of a town service and he is immediately labled as being in the enemy camp in some type of imaginary war.

I was out of NJ recently and what do I see but a house fire. It was going fairly strong. The local FD responded and I, above all people, was impressed. I never thought I'd say that. They worked like a well oiled machine and took control of the situation quicker than I had anticipated. There was a female FF, 3 white guys, and the rest were black or hispanic. I told one of them who was working WITH the others and happened to be the Chief, who was actually working instead of on call at home, and told him I thought they did a great job. As we talked, I asked him how the community could afford a paid Fire Department given the area he was in and the 100K to 150K that the NJ Firemen get. He didn't get defensive, he was friendly and responded that the top step Fireman made $50,000 a year and he, as the Chief, made $85,000 a year. He further stated that he knew other Fire Departments had regular fireman that made more than him and he was the Chief, not a new guy on the block. He said that by having that salary structure, nobody from the public complained, the FF thought it was a fair rate of pay, and that no one had left that FD for a different job as long as he could remember. He also said it was a good way to stay in business. A proud, sensible, and smart man I thought, as well as the rest of the group. He didn't have the look at me, Mefirst attitude. I felt these guys were worth every penny, another thing I never thought I would imagine. It's the extremely overpaid NJ Firemen salaries, benefits, and pension system that is pricing Fire Departments across NJ out of business. That trend will continue at a sure and steady pace. The "in your face," I'm the greatest and bravest person in the world and you are nothing creates a tremendous amount of warranted resentment and scorn of the citizens of NJ. The people have had enough and don't want anything to do with these "I'm a millionaire" firemen anymore. Harrison will soon be the next casualty in this quest of greed and disregard of others. Well said and fair Doc.

[doc13mets]

Hey Doc, I think you need to stick to what you know best, flipping burgers.

Actually I'm college educated and still work in education to this day. Maybe you should think outside the box.

[doc13mets]

Hey Doc, I think you need to stick to what you know best, flipping burgers.

If you really are a Harrison Firefighter that is sad. You guys should big bigger then stupid insults. You have worked hard to be where you are and offer a vital service to your town. You didn't actually respond to my proposal though. Didn't give another suggestion. Didn't offer any reasons why my idea wouldn't work. You just made an insult. How about you grow up, pay attention to what's going on in this state and around the country and figure out a way to help the situation and keep the citizens safe at the same time. I give anyone credit for at least coming up with ideas. Even bad ones. But just making stupid remarks and insulting people doesn't help anything.

[Guest Harrison's Bravest]

Why so quick to dump on Doc13mets? He had previously been praised by the FF faithfull for defending them on certain issues. Now the man offers what seems to be a viable solution to the inevitable breakdown of a town service and he is immediately labled as being in the enemy camp in some type of imaginary war.

I was out of NJ recently and what do I see but a house fire. It was going fairly strong. The local FD responded and I, above all people, was impressed. I never thought I'd say that. They worked like a well oiled machine and took control of the situation quicker than I had anticipated. There was a female FF, 3 white guys, and the rest were black or hispanic. I told one of them who was working WITH the others and happened to be the Chief, who was actually working instead of on call at home, and told him I thought they did a great job. As we talked, I asked him how the community could afford a paid Fire Department given the area he was in and the 100K to 150K that the NJ Firemen get. He didn't get defensive, he was friendly and responded that the top step Fireman made $50,000 a year and he, as the Chief, made $85,000 a year. He further stated that he knew other Fire Departments had regular fireman that made more than him and he was the Chief, not a new guy on the block. He said that by having that salary structure, nobody from the public complained, the FF thought it was a fair rate of pay, and that no one had left that FD for a different job as long as he could remember. He also said it was a good way to stay in business. A proud, sensible, and smart man I thought, as well as the rest of the group. He didn't have the look at me, Mefirst attitude. I felt these guys were worth every penny, another thing I never thought I would imagine. It's the extremely overpaid NJ Firemen salaries, benefits, and pension system that is pricing Fire Departments across NJ out of business. That trend will continue at a sure and steady pace. The "in your face," I'm the greatest and bravest person in the world and you are nothing creates a tremendous amount of warranted resentment and scorn of the citizens of NJ. The people have had enough and don't want anything to do with these "I'm a millionaire" firemen anymore. Harrison will soon be the next casualty in this quest of greed and disregard of others. Well said and fair Doc.

Make me laugh Barney, the last time you were out of state was when you took the tubes to the Village to buy crack.

[Guest Guest]

Almost 4 months have passed and still there have been only 2 very minor fires that really did not need the HFD to respond this year. How did Harrison have 276 fires 2 years ago that was reported to the State of NJ to determine aid and why is tiny little Harrison paying their second biggest line item of $5 million dollars to 40 guys for a basically not needed service? The School budget is # 1 as in all communities. That you expect. I looked and I could not find a city or town in NJ that has a bigger fire budget than the Police and the Police Budget includes many civilians. Also, on the Town of Harrison Official website that stupid fireman's poem is an embarrassing and should be taken off. Is ******'s daughter still on the payroll even though she doesn't work in town?

I guess it doesn't matter anyway because by next year a paid Harrison Fire Dept. will only be a memory. That expensive, wastefull chapter will be over. Turn the page.

Edited April 17, 2011 by KOTW
Content.

[Guest Harrison's Bravest]

Actually I'm college educated and still work in education to this day. Maybe you should think outside the box.

It's wonderful that you're college educated. I'm also college educated and an expert in fire service administration. I won't suggest ways for you to improve your work in the education field because I'm not qualified to do so. You might want to keep your opinions about things you know nothing about to yourself(with all due respect).

[Guest Guest]

Doc, don't even bother. They have a name and an excuse for every act of violence, like beating women or immoral behavior like taking drugs that you can ever find. They must have a book of excuses in the frat house. Next year, they will be sitting on a stool in an old man bar in Hudson County in the middle of a beautifull day hoping a fresh pair of drunken ears will come in to listen to their war stories and most likely get their *** kicked, again. " Do you remeber I ran into that burning buiding and......." Yeak, OK. **** off you unemployed drunken ex-fireman.

[Guest Guest]

What the heck is a degree in Fire Service Administration? What online non-accredited college has a program for that crap? If that is true then the entire undergraduate or graduate education program has gone to levels so low I thought I would never see in my life. "What did you major in at college Joe?" " I have a Associates degree in fire service administration." AHAHAHAHAH....You gotta be ****ing kidding! What a joke!

[doc13mets]

It's wonderful that you're college educated. I'm also college educated and an expert in fire service administration. I won't suggest ways for you to improve your work in the education field because I'm not qualified to do so. You might want to keep your opinions about things you know nothing about to yourself(with all due respect).

I've always supported the Fire Service. As many people on this site know I believe that Harrison and Kearny need fully staffed paid fire departments. I will continue to argue on that side even if one Harrison firefighter believe me to be from some "enemy camp".

With all due respect not only do I hold a Bachelor of Arts from a University in this state. I also am quite educated (formally) in the fire service field. If I wasn't I probably would be one of those people that claim Harrison should have volunteers get rid of all those paid guys. So I will keep commenting on fire related topics.

With all due respect. You still haven't pointed out any major flaws in my initial proposal. Again my proposal does not support layoffs of any kind. But offers a viable option for Harrison to continue with a fully paid fire service for their residents. Let's be real, Kearny would lose out on a merge (coverage wise) and so would East Newark (financially). But contracting East Newark to provide additional paid coverage once the next batch of guys retire is a potential solution. Let's be real. Harrison isn't going to replace those guys.

So lets have a real debate about this. Point out flaws and offer compromise and solutions. Hell maybe we can come up with some plan that works well and maybe the respective town administrators read this and get some good ideas.

[Guest Guest]

I understand that having a degree in Fire Services Administration is one of the most sought after degrees in most of todays large conglomerate organizations such as Berkshire Hathaway, Hallibuton, Microsoft, Pfizer, Federated Department Stores, and even our close to home Bloomberg LLP and Goldman Sachs. Being an expert in that field, or a fireman for that matter, have a greater demand than scientists concerning nuclear energy, stem cell research chemists, and doctors that are achieving ways to extend the life expectancy of human beings. Being philanthropic and creating ways of achieving the flow of clean water, agriculture, and vaccines for diseases that the world is closing in on in the next few years pales in comparison to being an expert in FSA. Sorry, I'm laughing so damn hard that I can barely stop. What on God's green earth is required to get a degree, I guess, in FSA? Does it require much more than a heartbeat or a pulse? That is some funny crap, OMG. Fire Services Administration, WTF, are you joking?

[Guest Guest]

Wal-Mart now sells 75% of all groceries purchased in the United States. I wonder if that degree in Fire Services Administration would be usefull in keeping those cooked chickens they sell nice-n-hot. Now there is a new career path for the lucky few. LOL.

[Guest Guest]

Why so quick to dump on Doc13mets? He had previously been praised by the FF faithfull for defending them on certain issues. Now the man offers what seems to be a viable solution to the inevitable breakdown of a town service and he is immediately labled as being in the enemy camp in some type of imaginary war.

I was out of NJ recently and what do I see but a house fire. It was going fairly strong. The local FD responded and I, above all people, was impressed. I never thought I'd say that. They worked like a well oiled machine and took control of the situation quicker than I had anticipated. There was a female FF, 3 white guys, and the rest were black or hispanic. I told one of them who was working WITH the others and happened to be the Chief, who was actually working instead of on call at home, and told him I thought they did a great job. As we talked, I asked him how the community could afford a paid Fire Department given the area he was in and the 100K to 150K that the NJ Firemen get. He didn't get defensive, he was friendly and responded that the top step Fireman made $50,000 a year and he, as the Chief, made $85,000 a year. He further stated that he knew other Fire Departments had regular fireman that made more than him and he was the Chief, not a new guy on the block. He said that by having that salary structure, nobody from the public complained, the FF thought it was a fair rate of pay, and that no one had left that FD for a different job as long as he could remember. He also said it was a good way to stay in business. A proud, sensible, and smart man I thought, as well as the rest of the group. He didn't have the look at me, Mefirst attitude. I felt these guys were worth every penny, another thing I never thought I would imagine. It's the extremely overpaid NJ Firemen salaries, benefits, and pension system that is pricing Fire Departments across NJ out of business. That trend will continue at a sure and steady pace. The "in your face," I'm the greatest and bravest person in the world and you are nothing creates a tremendous amount of warranted resentment and scorn of the citizens of NJ. The people have had enough and don't want anything to do with these "I'm a millionaire" firemen anymore. Harrison will soon be the next casualty in this quest of greed and disregard of others. Well said and fair Doc.

Not that I'm doubting your story at all but what state were you in. Thats a pretty big piece of information you are leaving out of the story.

[Guest Guest]

I do not think that accusing a man of being on drugs is maoral in any sense of the word. The man's reputation is at stake here. Plus, the only crack he has been using is the ***** ****** your ***** ****. Unfortunately, **** ***** ***** smells like a garbage dump on a hot ****

Edited April 18, 2011 by KOTW
Content.

[mrmike]

Well Doc I didn't want to jump in on this one but...

Simply put ENFD is a Volunteer Dept.,you wish to replace paid firefighters with paid volunteers, basicly dodging Civil Service and the tests and lists involved.

If you were next on the list to be made in Harrison and found out that instead they were going to use guys from a volunteer dept. and pay them how would you feel about that?

More to the point, that's a hell of a lawsuit in the making.

I understand your desire to become a firefighter I also assume you are a part of the ENFD.

This is not the way to do it.

And frankly I'm damned surprised that with your understanding of the fire service you'd even suggest it.

jus sayin

[Guest Guest]

http://cliffviewpilot.com/editorials/op-ed/2230-me-first-heres-how-much-you-really-pay-for-police-fire-in-nj

[Guest guest]

What was that article supposed to prove? Another stupid Democrat trying to struggle with his limited capabilities. Just shut up, please!

[doc13mets]

Well Doc I didn't want to jump in on this one but...

Simply put ENFD is a Volunteer Dept.,you wish to replace paid firefighters with paid volunteers, basicly dodging Civil Service and the tests and lists involved.

If you were next on the list to be made in Harrison and found out that instead they were going to use guys from a volunteer dept. and pay them how would you feel about that?

More to the point, that's a hell of a lawsuit in the making.

I understand your desire to become a firefighter I also assume you are a part of the ENFD.

This is not the way to do it.

And frankly I'm damned surprised that with your understanding of the fire service you'd even suggest it.

jus sayin

Let's be real hear. Harrison isn't going to hire anyone off of any list any time soon. When was the last time they hired? 6 or 7 years ago? If the next person on the list was a Kearny, Harrison or even East Newark resident I would be all for them getting hired. I do support the civil service method and the rules prescribed but unfortunately due to a lawsuit by the NCAAP back in the day Kearny and Harrison haven't been able to operate under those rules outlined for civil service procedures. They no longer can have a residency preference which makes the process unfair.

Unfair how... well why is it fair that a Jersey City or Newark resident can be put on a hiring list in the town where I have grown up my whole life and I can't be put on theirs?

For that one reason I believe the Civil Service hiring rules are unfair.

And how do you think it felt to be the next guy on Harrison's FD list back when the Jackson Volunteer Fire Department's paid drivers were hired through the Rice Bill?

I am for all Civil Service protections once hired though.

I myself currently it would be an extremely difficult decision to make to be a paid firefighter for East Newark under the plan I proposed. I would be taking a pay cut for one in the 10's of thousands. In my current job I don't pay a dime for my health care and I also get a pension which I do not contribute and I just got vested in that.

I would like to see Kearny and Harrison firefighters be from Kearny and Harrison and well maybe even East Newark. Otherwise you get some people who make statements such as "Why would I take one foot in that firehouse if they aren't paying me." I hope and truely believe the majority of the newer guys aren't like that but one bad apple spoiled my taste of them. (Especially considering I pay his salary)

Beyond that I personally think all volunteer firefighters should get preference right along with Military Vets for performing a civil duty.

Back when North Hudson regionalized a few guys from the Volunteer department through a law suit were immediately hired. So it's not unreal. But my plan is much much different as the newly hired firefighters would not be Harrison employees.

But never mind all of that.

There is a serious problem in Harrison. The problem is in the near future there will not be able to provide adequate fire protection for themselves. I really don't know how it got so bad so quick. But the fact is it is bad and something needs to be done.

Contracting another town for additional fire protection is not illegal and is done all over the country and I'm sure there are cases of it in NJ. The town they contract the service from how they hire is not of the other towns concern as long as they provide what they are being contracted for.

I'm simply offering a suggestion to help increase paid fire protection in Harrison because I believe there is a need for it. Under the current system and contracts in Harrison it's just not going to happen and that's pretty much a fact.

If Harrison decides to forgo that I believe there only other alternative would be to create their own Volunteer Department which I don't believe is the best thing for Harrison because oppose to contrary belief they are a busy town.

I don't want to see any Harrison Firefighter or Police officer lose their job. All the guys I've come to know and meet are all good guys. They do care about their job and their community.

The one thing I do know about the fire service is the advantages of a career department. I want to see that continue in West Hudson. The way things are sounding though the 40+ man department of Harrison is going to be history. When they are down to 20 odd men do you feel confident the residents will be protected? I know those guys will do their damn best, but its not fair to the residents who pay what they pay in taxes.

I'm thinking outside the box here and trying to provide viable solutions to the problem. If you recall a year ago when they were first faced with layoffs I suggestion a decrease in the amount of captains and the creation of the lieutenant rank to help save jobs. That was thinking outside the box.

The only other idea I ever hear is "Make Harrison volunteer" and then they make some jokes about lobsters and a big purple dinosaur. It drives me nuts.

I ask Harrison's Bravest and Jus' sayin to offer up some real solutions of their own to increase or at least preserve (at today's levels) Harrison's fire protection while cutting budgets the way Harrison Mayor and Council are doing.

[doc13mets]

http://cliffviewpilot.com/editorials/op-ed/2230-me-first-heres-how-much-you-really-pay-for-police-fire-in-nj

Great article. I personally would vote to increase taxes (with in reason) if it guaranteed public safety at the levels I have now. I've said that from day one. Unfortunately I don't think it's ever been put on the table in Harrison or Kearny.

[Guest Guest]

Doc, with all due respect, why do you continue to support these ***wipe fraternity clowns (HFD KFD) when all they do is abuse you. Thats all they know. How to abuse the citizens while making empty threats and consistantly opening their mouths around someone they perceive as weaker. They then proceed get their but kicked in spectacular fashion while their own " brothers " look on and are afraid to even move to help. Did you notice that Hannibal Lecture, Mr. superstar Kearny woman beater fireman fan Jus Sayin, used some choice words in his post. He said that, " guys were on the list to get made." What is he talking about? Is this the Soprano's and the guys were gonna get their button and become a " made " man in the KFD Mafia. This Jus Sayin jeroff has a bigger ego than Donald Trump. He is a little piss ant frat boy in Dirtwater NJ and thinks he's the new John Gotti. Being a made man, OMG. This guy has gotta be suspended or fired by the Mayor of Kearny because he is bringing real shame to the people, unlike him, who live there.

[mrmike]

Well Doc in answer to your primary question...

It's not fair, not in the least, either all towns should be allowed to have residency requirements or there should just be one state wide list, period.

Now if your not aware of it let me tell you that most politicians do not like Civil Service because it's testing and lists preclude them from picking and choosing who they'd like to have, though it doesn't completely eliminate the possibility. As an example if a favorite son scores high enough on the list maybe a few extra hires are made to get to them. Nothings perfect.

As far as your suggestion, like it or not it will be a way to circumvent the system and allow for "select placements". How about for your job in education we replace full time with part time subs at a lower rate no benefits and of course no loyalty to you or your union but beholding to the powers that be?

Would that be fair? Hiring anyone means that there's a need and therefore you go through the process that has been laid out through Civil Service.

Gov. Christie will have you believe that we are the reason for the States economic problems but our pension has been subsidizing the States budget for years and the Police and Fire ranks have been thinned by the thousands through layoffs and retirement.

Have your taxes gone down or even stabilized?

Why not?

Because the "Players" on Wall Street who are the instigators of this are still playing, but they contribute a hell of a lot more to campaign funds than you or I ever will.

This is not to say the Politicians don't have a very big hand in all of this, they do, but ultimately we all own that one because we elected them and didn't hold them accountable.

As far a Veterens preferance I do not support the current policy, I believe we should be adding maybe 5 points to their test scores not automaticly bumping them to the top, the purpose of the testing is to get the best so lets keep that in mind.

Though I see no problem with a similar policy for those that are trained Volunteer firefighters.

Want to stop the residency disparity? You and any other resident on the list should be filing a class action suit, common sense tells us it should be a slam dunk,residents like you are getting screwed and so are the Town residents no doubt about it.

Now since I'm on the subject of Hiring this one is for "Guest" though I'm sure it will fall on deaf ears.

Is it not uncommon for sons to follow in their fathers footsteps? No it's not.

The Trade Unions are full of multigenerational employees, Grandfathers, Fathers,Sons etc...

Fishermen, doctors, lawyers you name it.

As much as a Police or Firefighters son may want to follow in Dads footsteps he still has to take the test and score high enough to get hired, for every son you see on the job there's probably 5 others out there that never made it.

Which begs the question, what did your Dad do for a living? Was he raised to be hateful and disrespectful? Are you carrying on a family tradition, or starting one?

jus sayin

[doc13mets]

Doc, with all due respect, why do you continue to support these ***wipe fraternity clowns (HFD KFD) when all they do is abuse you. Thats all they know. How to abuse the citizens while making empty threats and consistantly opening their mouths around someone they perceive as weaker. They then proceed get their but kicked in spectacular fashion while their own " brothers " look on and are afraid to even move to help. Did you notice that Hannibal Lecture, Mr. superstar Kearny woman beater fireman fan Jus Sayin, used some choice words in his post. He said that, " guys were on the list to get made." What is he talking about? Is this the Soprano's and the guys were gonna get their button and become a " made " man in the KFD Mafia. This Jus Sayin jeroff has a bigger ego than Donald Trump. He is a little piss ant frat boy in Dirtwater NJ and thinks he's the new John Gotti. Being a made man, OMG. This guy has gotta be suspended or fired by the Mayor of Kearny because he is bringing real shame to the people, unlike him, who live there.

While I believe Jus sayin's intentions are good he may not be the best PR person as sometimes his points come across the wrong way. But if you read between the lines he's trying to make a point. I don't defend any one person in this matter. I just speak to my belief that I believe Kearny and Harrison are best served with a career fire department. Fire protection makes up a small amount of the tax payers dollar in terms of % of total taxes paid. If we lost career fire protection our Fire Insurance rates will surely go up. Taxes will not be lowered that I am sure of.

Look over to North Arlington how much do they pay in taxes? Wait what? They have a volunteer department. Wow where are the tax savings there?

Kearny FD provides a great service that I would never want to see reduced.

It's a shame what is happening in Harrison. Something needs to be done, thats why I am trying to offer solutions.

[Guest Guest]

Civil service was a good idea but it was immediately corrupted by politicians who made sure that the guy they wanted to be a "made man," had the highest score on the list, even though it was clear the person didn't have the mental capacity to score nearly that high, right Jus Sayin? I personally saw a guy who was a cop for like forty years and he couldn't be put on a squad, write a ticket, do a simple arrest or incident report so the town just let him walk around and hang out in the locker room and watch TV. I don't think he could sign his own name, he might have been able to print it but thats at its best. He took the Sgts. test without any prep course against like 20 hungry young smart guys that spent $3000.00 on a promtional exam class. Mr. forty year stupid came out #1 on the test, got to be a "made man," and retired immediately after his year that he had to put in to retire as a Sgt. pension. As a Sgt., his new responsibilities consisted of spending even more time watching TV, thats it! I witnessed a miracle on this earth before my 30th birthday. Go NJ.

[doc13mets]

Well Doc in answer to your primary question...

It's not fair, not in the least, either all towns should be allowed to have residency requirements or there should just be one state wide list, period.

Now if your not aware of it let me tell you that most politicians do not like Civil Service because it's testing and lists preclude them from picking and choosing who they'd like to have, though it doesn't completely eliminate the possibility. As an example if a favorite son scores high enough on the list maybe a few extra hires are made to get to them. Nothings perfect.

As far as your suggestion, like it or not it will be a way to circumvent the system and allow for "select placements". How about for your job in education we replace full time with part time subs at a lower rate no benefits and of course no loyalty to you or your union but beholding to the powers that be?

Would that be fair? Hiring anyone means that there's a need and therefore you go through the process that has been laid out through Civil Service.

Gov. Christie will have you believe that we are the reason for the States economic problems but our pension has been subsidizing the States budget for years and the Police and Fire ranks have been thinned by the thousands through layoffs and retirement.

Have your taxes gone down or even stabilized?

Why not?

Because the "Players" on Wall Street who are the instigators of this are still playing, but they contribute a hell of a lot more to campaign funds than you or I ever will.

This is not to say the Politicians don't have a very big hand in all of this, they do, but ultimately we all own that one because we elected them and didn't hold them accountable.

As far a Veterens preferance I do not support the current policy, I believe we should be adding maybe 5 points to their test scores not automaticly bumping them to the top, the purpose of the testing is to get the best so lets keep that in mind.

Though I see no problem with a similar policy for those that are trained Volunteer firefighters.

Want to stop the residency disparity? You and any other resident on the list should be filing a class action suit, common sense tells us it should be a slam dunk,residents like you are getting screwed and so are the Town residents no doubt about it.

Now since I'm on the subject of Hiring this one is for "Guest" though I'm sure it will fall on deaf ears.

Is it not uncommon for sons to follow in their fathers footsteps? No it's not.

The Trade Unions are full of multigenerational employees, Grandfathers, Fathers,Sons etc...

Fishermen, doctors, lawyers you name it.

As much as a Police or Firefighters son may want to follow in Dads footsteps he still has to take the test and score high enough to get hired, for every son you see on the job there's probably 5 others out there that never made it.

Which begs the question, what did your Dad do for a living? Was he raised to be hateful and disrespectful? Are you carrying on a family tradition, or starting one?

jus sayin

I agree with all of your points and responses. I have often been thinking about a class action lawsuit in the residency case.

Personally I don't think this is a way to circumvent anything. Towns from time to time contract other towns to provide services. Just because East Newark happens to not be civil service shouldn't stop anyone from discussing such a deal. East Newarks cops are paid less then Harrison cops it's just a matter of fact that East Newark employees make less, so it's a way for Harrison to benefit.

Do you agree that more paid firefighters are a better thing?

Do you agree under the current system Harrison will not hire more firefighters?

I believe you will say yes to both then why not entertain this idea?

East Newark will still have to offer a test of sorts, just like Millburn, Montclair, Cherry Hill and other such Paid non civil service towns do.

I have to say that was one of your most on point posts I've read. I guess thats what we get when we actually discuss and debate questions without just making stupid insults. Wish we could have more of this on this board!!