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A successful revolution:


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President Obama just showed how to help a people successfully move toward democracy. He didn't make it about himself or claim that it was up to him. He worked quietly behind the scenes to help make it happen.

Whether Egypt will become democratic is up them. People have to want democracy. Egypt's chance at a freer and more open society didn't cost the American people hundreds of billions of dollars or thousands of our young people killed. We should all be proud of our president for his responsible leadership.

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Guest Patriot

President Obama just showed how to help a people successfully move toward democracy. He didn't make it about himself or claim that it was up to him. He worked quietly behind the scenes to help make it happen.

Whether Egypt will become democratic is up them. People have to want democracy. Egypt's chance at a freer and more open society didn't cost the American people hundreds of billions of dollars or thousands of our young people killed. We should all be proud of our president for his responsible leadership.

Easy on the Kool-Aid buddy. "worked quietly behind the scenes"?? You're privy to what zerO does behind the scenes?? What zerO really did was throw Mubarek under the bus and announce to our allies in the middle east that we won't stand with them. BTW- You have to stop getting your news from MSNBC and Huffington.

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Easy on the Kool-Aid buddy. "worked quietly behind the scenes"?? You're privy to what zerO does behind the scenes?? What zerO really did was throw Mubarek under the bus and announce to our allies in the middle east that we won't stand with them. BTW- You have to stop getting your news from MSNBC and Huffington.

The entire region is now heading toward democracy, thanks in part to the intelligent diplomacy of President Obama. It would be awful if you had to give him credit.

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Guest Patriot

The entire region is now heading toward democracy, thanks in part to the intelligent diplomacy of President Obama. It would be awful if you had to give him credit.

If any middle eastern countries gain a democracy it will be because of the brave citizens that rioted in the streets at the risk of their lives. Certainly not because of anything our apologizing president zerO did.

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Guest Kearny Kissinger

If any middle eastern countries gain a democracy it will be because of the brave citizens that rioted in the streets at the risk of their lives. Certainly not because of anything our apologizing president zerO did.

Well it certainly wasn't anything George Bush did -- remember that bromantic secret trip to visit Saudia Arabia's King Fahd?

Republicans don't know how to handle this one. Tried to criticize Obama for not supporting Mubarak when protests started, McCain, or gone completely silent, Romney and Palin.

LOL!

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Well it certainly wasn't anything George Bush did -- remember that bromantic secret trip to visit Saudia Arabia's King Fahd?

Republicans don't know how to handle this one. Tried to criticize Obama for not supporting Mubarak when protests started, McCain, or gone completely silent, Romney and Palin.

LOL!

Huh ??

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If any middle eastern countries gain a democracy it will be because of the brave citizens that rioted in the streets at the risk of their lives. Certainly not because of anything our apologizing president zerO did.

Dumbo,

The fact that Egypt has made these gains is because of what the Egyptian people did. That's exactly what I said. If you had bothered to read the post, you would have seen that. But because I also give President Obama the credit he is due for not trying to dictate democracy to the Egyptian people (even you must see the contradiction), you did what you always do and just reacted. Your argument is called a false choice. The Egyptian people took the lead but President Obama's intelligent and responsible foreign policy also helped.

We all know that you'll never admit that President Obama has done plenty of things right or that Bush, or any Republican, ever did anything wrong. But your extreme partisanship isn't the point.

The point is that people gain democracy because they want it and fight for it on their own. That's what the Egyptian people are doing. Instead of invading Egypt, President Obama did what he could to make their success possible. The reason he won the Nobel Peace Prize is that he changed the course of our foreign policy. He hadn't been in office long but the previous policy was so bad that a major change like as we have seen under President Obama has had a tremendous and beneficial impact for the world. What is now happening across Northern African and the Middle East is due partly to that.

I can give you the information and the analysis but I can't give you the brains or the temperament to understand them.

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Guest Patriot

Dumbo,

The fact that Egypt has made these gains is because of what the Egyptian people did. That's exactly what I said. If you had bothered to read the post, you would have seen that. But because I also give President Obama the credit he is due for not trying to dictate democracy to the Egyptian people (even you must see the contradiction), you did what you always do and just reacted. Your argument is called a false choice. The Egyptian people took the lead but President Obama's intelligent and responsible foreign policy also helped.

We all know that you'll never admit that President Obama has done plenty of things right or that Bush, or any Republican, ever did anything wrong. But your extreme partisanship isn't the point.

The point is that people gain democracy because they want it and fight for it on their own. That's what the Egyptian people are doing. Instead of invading Egypt, President Obama did what he could to make their success possible. The reason he won the Nobel Peace Prize is that he changed the course of our foreign policy. He hadn't been in office long but the previous policy was so bad that a major change like as we have seen under President Obama has had a tremendous and beneficial impact for the world. What is now happening across Northern African and the Middle East is due partly to that.

I can give you the information and the analysis but I can't give you the brains or the temperament to understand them.

You cannot be serious. zerO didn't win (which infers competition) the Nobel, he was handed the prize by

the far, far left Nobel committee. zerO is just the latest in a string of far left loons to be handed the Nobel. The Nobel Peace Prize has become a farce and a world-wide joke. Giving it to zerO after previously giving it to Arafat should be a clue.

As far as the rest of your post is concerned, it's as nonsensical as zerO's peace prize.

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Guest Union Boss??

YOU ALL NEED TO KNOW

THE

“Secret GOP plan":

Push states to declare bankruptcy, and smash all unions.

The Secret GOP Plan is not a secret--many states are in deep "do-do" and are on the verge of bankruptcy. Smashing unions is not the plan. The plan is to control the taxes we pay. The well is running dry. If everyone in our country was employed with a great, high paying job, our tax revenues would be raised just because more people were paying taxes and all would happy. But, that is not the case. Giving people pay raises doesn't make them more productive. Tenure is a good tool to keep stability. But tenure is great for people who are just "putting in their time" since they are "safe," have limited responsibilities, and the pay raises come whether your good or bad, so some would say "why be good?"

For all the money that we pay in taxes here in Kearny you would think that our school system would be "top shelf." Being 230th proves that money doesn't make the system great--people make it great. That means the Administrators, the teachers, and the staff as well as the parents are accountable. Someplace along those lines "we--they" are failing.

Unions are good if you like socialism/communism. All are paid the same for years of work (seniority)--all are treated equally. Good or bad, you have been at the job six years, therefore your pay is XYZ. Next year, you get a pay raise since you will be on the seventh step--good or bad has nothing to do with it. If you are the employee of the year, you get a nice piece of paper that is framed for you--money, no way as that is against the union's equality for all. Why be the employee of the year? Who need a piece of paper in a frame? Keep your mouth shut, take the pay, and do the minimum that is required of you. Be a drone, go to a rally, look as unprofessional as you can be (which is usually the way you go to work anyway), carry a sign, vote for who your union is backing (usually a Democrat unless some deal has been made with a Republican candidate), and get POed if you union's candidate losses. Simple life for simple people. Time to wake up "Union People." Time to "THINK." You can't get more money from people who don't have money.

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You cannot be serious. zerO didn't win (which infers competition) the Nobel, he was handed the prize by

the far, far left Nobel committee. zerO is just the latest in a string of far left loons to be handed the Nobel. The Nobel Peace Prize has become a farce and a world-wide joke. Giving it to zerO after previously giving it to Arafat should be a clue.

As far as the rest of your post is concerned, it's as nonsensical as zerO's peace prize.

Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/10/09/us-nobel-peace-obama-idUSTRE5981JK20091009

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9B7GRQG1

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/10/09/obama-surprised-deeply-humbled-nobel-peace-prize/

Gee, those sources must be loony! :lol:

Oh, wait, there's another possibility:

Patrat, aka 2Stupid4Words, might be wrong! :o

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Now THIS is an amusing thread. Nothing but talking points from both sides.

Obama did a horrible job here. The administration sent out somewhat conflicting messages until it was clear which way the wind was blowing. There is no evidence he did anything whatsoever.

However, the Right did the same thing-you'll note that at first Patriot thought Obama should support the Egyptian government over the will of the Egyptian people, then once the pundits told him what to think he supported the democratic revolution.

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Guest Kearny Kissinger

Now THIS is an amusing thread. Nothing but talking points from both sides.

Obama did a horrible job here. The administration sent out somewhat conflicting messages until it was clear which way the wind was blowing. There is no evidence he did anything whatsoever.

However, the Right did the same thing-you'll note that at first Patriot thought Obama should support the Egyptian government over the will of the Egyptian people, then once the pundits told him what to think he supported the democratic revolution.

Gadfly,

I don't agree with your observations on the Obama Administration. Yes, during the first week of the January 25 Revolution, the Obama administration did not perform well by endorsing a Mubarak-led transition to questionable elections. Midway through the 18-day revolution, Obama clearly changed course ("Now means yesterday") and told Mubarak he was done and had to leave office.

Unlike Obama, Republicans never recovered (McCain, Palin, Romney, Pawlenty showed no leadership). There's no easy talking point on this one for the right wing. They're adamantly pro-Israel (to the point of criticizing George W. Bush on his advocacy of a 2-state solution) and Israel strongly wanted Mubarak to remain. The right wing also professes to be on a global freedom mission. So it's Israeli security concerns versus freedom, not an easy choice. That's why Republicans froze. And why Obama almost missed the boat.

Has Palin said anything yet about whether it was the right thing to do to push out Mubarak? No. Only general statements that avoided facing the hard question in Egypt.

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Gadfly,

I don't agree with your observations on the Obama Administration. Yes, during the first week of the January 25 Revolution, the Obama administration did not perform well by endorsing a Mubarak-led transition to questionable elections. Midway through the 18-day revolution, Obama clearly changed course ("Now means yesterday") and told Mubarak he was done and had to leave office.

Unlike Obama, Republicans never recovered (McCain, Palin, Romney, Pawlenty showed no leadership). There's no easy talking point on this one for the right wing. They're adamantly pro-Israel (to the point of criticizing George W. Bush on his advocacy of a 2-state solution) and Israel strongly wanted Mubarak to remain. The right wing also professes to be on a global freedom mission. So it's Israeli security concerns versus freedom, not an easy choice. That's why Republicans froze. And why Obama almost missed the boat.

Has Palin said anything yet about whether it was the right thing to do to push out Mubarak? No. Only general statements that avoided facing the hard question in Egypt.

As I stated above, "until it was clear which way the wind was blowing." I slammed the Right as well. I agree that they have yet to produce a consistent message. Maybe my skepticism about our politicians from both sides is unfounded but I seriously doubt it.

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Guest Kearny Kissinger

As I stated above, "until it was clear which way the wind was blowing." I slammed the Right as well. I agree that they have yet to produce a consistent message. Maybe my skepticism about our politicians from both sides is unfounded but I seriously doubt it.

Gadfly,

No you can't lump them all together. Obama changed course at the mid-point of the revolution when it was still unclear what the outcome would be. Where was everyone else? US political conservatives couldn't take a side or took the wrong (Mubarak) side because of their strident pro-Israel positions. The European Union lagged because of Suez Canal concerns. Most middle East countries and China had no moral standing and tried to ignore it. The UN dithered.

I wish Obama was forceful on day 1 of the 18-day revolution. But he recovered in time and was THE world leader saying to Mubarak it was time to go. Compared to everyone else, he gets an A.

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