Cole bomber turned loose.

[Guest Patriot]

Today Obama turned loose the Cole bomber, a terrorist who admitted his involvement in the bombing of a US ship that killed 17 sailors. The families of those murdered sailors are in disbelief that Obama ordered him turned loose.

Obama has done more harm to our military's morale in his first three weeks in office than Clinton ever did, no small feat.

We know that Obama has Muslim relatives, I'm wondering if the bomber was a cousin.

[Guest Guest]

I don't believe he was released, but I do think the charges were dropped. So, we can't have Gitmo because the criminals have "rights", but, as of now, we can hold someone without charges. Probably would have been best to let the tribunal go on as scheduled.

But hey, I feel safer, how about you.

[WilliamK]

Today Obama turned loose the Cole bomber, a terrorist who admitted his involvement in the bombing of a US ship that killed 17 sailors. The families of those murdered sailors are in disbelief that Obama ordered him turned loose.

Obama has done more harm to our military's morale in his first three weeks in office than Clinton ever did, no small feat.

We know that Obama has Muslim relatives, I'm wondering if the bomber was a cousin.

Contrary to your blatant and malicious lie, al-Nashiri has not in any sense been "turned loose". He remains in custody, and will be re-tried. Dropping the charges was done to work around one judge's refusal to comply with an executive order requiring all the cases to be halted in order to conduct a review. The case was dismissed without prejudice, meaning that the charges can be brought again.

[Guest Keith]

Today Obama turned loose the Cole bomber, a terrorist who admitted his involvement in the bombing of a US ship that killed 17 sailors. The families of those murdered sailors are in disbelief that Obama ordered him turned loose.

Obama has done more harm to our military's morale in his first three weeks in office than Clinton ever did, no small feat.

We know that Obama has Muslim relatives, I'm wondering if the bomber was a cousin.

Wow. You are amazing. I'm not sure which is worse. Is it the fact that you are totally ignorant of the actual fact are that you are very aware of the facts but you just don't care. Either way you are amazing but not in a good way.

[WilliamK]

You're missing out on a golden opportunity here, Patriot. You could demonstrate some real decency and character by issuing a retraction and an earnest apology for your incendiary lie, and show that you are not the gutless, lying piece of garbage that you appear to be.

[Guest Paul]

Wow. You are amazing. I'm not sure which is worse. Is it the fact that you are totally ignorant of the actual fact are that you are very aware of the facts but you just don't care. Either way you are amazing but not in a good way.

Tragically, the Republican party has become radical over the past thirty years or so. They lie and they don't care that they're lying. It's how they have learned to win elections and stay in power. As a result, the Republican party bears very little resemblance to the Republican party of thirty years ago and before. Many rank-and-file Republicans aren't like that, but they don't seem to have figured out just how radical their party has become.

The "new Republican" strategy works perfectly with the modern media, where information is reduced to mindless sound bites. They congratulate themselves for outsmaring their adversaries, but what they are really doing is destroying the social and political fabric of our country. If you point that out, you are seen as the radical. It's Orwell's nightmare come true. This is not surprising, considering that they rose to power on a deliberate strategy of race-baiting (Nixon's Southern strategy).

So for example, right now we hear Republican Senators opposing the stimulus bill currently under consideration on the grounds that it's a spending bill, not a stimulus bill. Fortunately, Obama was smart enough to get the fact that this was a meaningless rhetorical dodge. But that's only one example. Republicans in Congress do this sort of thing every day, and when an important vote comes up they do it more.

Another example is "Patriot," a/k/a "2smart4u," formerly "BushBacker." The most charitably I can put it is that he is so consumed by his ideology that he sees nothing else. I'm tempted to say that he doesn't care about the truth, but he probably does, at least as an ideal. Problem is, any time the facts don't fit what he believes, he just ignores the facts, just as he will ignore the facts pointed out in posts 2-5 above. On this forum his non-response takes the form of scorn, contempt and derision - whatever deflects any impetus that might be placed on him to think about what he says he believes. I wish I could say this behavior was confined to right wingers, but it's not. However, they do seem to have perfected it.

A few of the people practicing Limbaugh-style politics get it and just don't care. I don't understand how they manage to justify it, but somehow they do. Most right wingers manage to overlook it or don't understand what is going on. What makes it possible is that most Americans who don't agree with them don't understand it either. They think that the leadership of an entire political party can't be that despicable, so the critics must be the radicals.

I hope the American people figure this out soon.

[Guest Keith]

Tragically, the Republican party has become radical over the past thirty years or so. They lie and they don't care that they're lying. It's how they have learned to win elections and stay in power. But as a result, the Republican party bears very little resemblance to the Republican party of thirty years ago and more. Many rank-and-file Republicans aren't like that, but they don't seem to have figured out just how radical their party has become.

The "new Republican" strategy works perfectly with the modern media, where information is reduced to mindless sound bites. They congratulate themselves for outsmaring their adversaries, but what they are really doing is destroying the social and political fabric of our country. If you point that out, you are seen as the radical. It's Orwell's nightmare come true.

So for example, right now we hear Republican Senators opposing the stimulus bill currently under consideration on the grounds that it's a spending bill, not a stimulus bill. Fortunately, Obama was smart enough to get the fact that this was a meaningless rhetorical dodge. But that's only one example. Republicans in Congress do this sort of thing every day, and when an important vote comes up they do it more.

Another example is "Patriot," a/k/a "2smart4u," formerly "BushBacker." The most charitably I can put it is that he is so consumed by his ideology that he sees nothing else. I'm tempted to say that he doesn't care about the truth, but he probably does, at least as an ideal. Problem is, any time the facts don't fit what he believes, he just ignores the facts. On this forum that takes the form of scorn, contempt and derision - whatever deflects any impetus that might be placed on him to think about what he says he believes. I wish I could say this behavior was confined to right wingers, but it's not.

A few of the people practicing Limbaugh-style politics get it and just don't care. I don't understand how they manage to justify it, but somehow they do. Most of them manage to overlook it or don't understand what is going on. What makes it possible is that most Americans who don't agree with them don't understand it either. They think that the leadership of an entire political party can't be that despicable, so the critics must be the radicals.

I hope the American people figure this out soon.

Let's also not forget that they call themselves christians. The hypocrisy is palpable.

[Guest 2smart4u]

igquote name='Paul' date='Feb 8 2009, 03:40 PM' post='94770']

Tragically, the Republican party has become radical over the past thirty years or so. They lie and they don't care that they're lying. It's how they have learned to win elections and stay in power. As a result, the Republican party bears very little resemblance to the Republican party of thirty years ago and before. Many rank-and-file Republicans aren't like that, but they don't seem to have figured out just how radical their party has become.

The "new Republican" strategy works perfectly with the modern media, where information is reduced to mindless sound bites. They congratulate themselves for outsmaring their adversaries, but what they are really doing is destroying the social and political fabric of our country. If you point that out, you are seen as the radical. It's Orwell's nightmare come true. This is not surprising, considering that they rose to power on a deliberate strategy of race-baiting (Nixon's Southern strategy).

So for example, right now we hear Republican Senators opposing the stimulus bill currently under consideration on the grounds that it's a spending bill, not a stimulus bill. Fortunately, Obama was smart enough to get the fact that this was a meaningless rhetorical dodge. But that's only one example. Republicans in Congress do this sort of thing every day, and when an important vote comes up they do it more.

Another example is "Patriot," a/k/a "2smart4u," formerly "BushBacker." The most charitably I can put it is that he is so consumed by his ideology that he sees nothing else. I'm tempted to say that he doesn't care about the truth, but he probably does, at least as an ideal. Problem is, any time the facts don't fit what he believes, he just ignores the facts, just as he will ignore the facts pointed out in posts 2-5 above. On this forum his non-response takes the form of scorn, contempt and derision - whatever deflects any impetus that might be placed on him to think about what he says he believes. I wish I could say this behavior was confined to right wingers, but it's not. However, they do seem to have perfected it.

A few of the people practicing Limbaugh-style politics get it and just don't care. I don't understand how they manage to justify it, but somehow they do. Most right wingers manage to overlook it or don't understand what is going on. What makes it possible is that most Americans who don't agree with them don't understand it either. They think that the leadership of an entire political party can't be that despicable, so the critics must be the radicals.

I hope the American people figure this out soon.

Yeah, you're right, Paul. We're all radicals who lie and we don't care if we lie. Speaking about lying, during the campaign, Obama spoke about how we must abandon the "politics of fear". Yet Obama threatened a catastrophe if the stimulus bill wasn't passed. No fear mongering there, right?

[Guest Guest]

Yeah, you're right, Paul. We're all radicals who lie and we don't care if we lie. Speaking about lying, during the campaign, Obama spoke about how we must abandon the "politics of fear". Yet Obama threatened a catastrophe if the stimulus bill wasn't passed. No fear mongering there, right?

In other words, you don't have anything to say in your own defense so you do what you always do and attack the other guy. We're in an economic catastrophe. That's not spin, it's a fact. If Obama wasn't warning us about it, you would criticize him for that, because that's all you do. You criticize whomever you don't agree with. If he goes left, you criticize him. If he goes right, you criticize him. If he goes forward or backward you criticize him. If he stands still you criticize him. You made up your mind that you're going to criticize him no matter what he does. Facts don't matter to you. Paul wrote it and you just proved it --- again.

[Guest Guest]

Tragically, the Republican party has become radical over the past thirty years or so. They lie and they don't care that they're lying. It's how they have learned to win elections and stay in power. As a result, the Republican party bears very little resemblance to the Republican party of thirty years ago and before. Many rank-and-file Republicans aren't like that, but they don't seem to have figured out just how radical their party has become.

So true.

Obama tried to reason with them but all they do is obstruct. Led by their real leader Rush Limbaugh. The next chance we have to get rid of some of them is the 2010 election.

Can we afford to have them around obstructing for another two years? I don't think so. The Republicans are dangerous. As dangerous as having criminals loose in our neighborhoods. Criminals steal, so do the Republicans.

Their medieval economic and social ideas are costing us jobs, our livelihood, lowering our living standard of living. They're stealing our livelihood.

Its not a great consolation voting them out of office two years from now if thanks to them you are unemployed or your living wage has suffered much that you can't pay your bills or pay for a decent higher education for your children.

[Guest 2smart4u]

So true.

Obama tried to reason with them but all they do is obstruct. Led by their real leader Rush Limbaugh. The next chance we have to get rid of some of them is the 2010 election.

Can we afford to have them around obstructing for another two years? I don't think so. The Republicans are dangerous. As dangerous as having criminals loose in our neighborhoods. Criminals steal, so do the Republicans.

Their medieval economic and social ideas are costing us jobs, our livelihood, lowering our living standard of living. They're stealing our livelihood.

Its not a great consolation voting them out of office two years from now if thanks to them you are unemployed or your living wage has suffered much that you can't pay your bills or pay for a decent higher education for your children.

You left out two things, Republicans eat Democratic babies and rape their women.

[Guest Paul]

Yeah, you're right, Paul. We're all radicals who lie and we don't care if we lie. Speaking about lying, during the campaign, Obama spoke about how we must abandon the "politics of fear". Yet Obama threatened a catastrophe if the stimulus bill wasn't passed. No fear mongering there, right?

So what would you like me to tell you? You've opened half a dozen topics in the past few days alone, and there's scarcely a shred of truth in anything you wrote. People have pointed out to you that you're posting things that aren't true, and given you links to verify the fact. Instead of retracting and apologizing, you just ignore the facts and put up another post that isn't true. After a while, the only reasonable conclusion is that you don't care about the truth, and you keep saying things anyway. That's called lying.

And what would you like Obama to tell you? We're in an economic crisis. Every economist is predicting it will get worse and that we could be headed for an epic calamity. He's talking about things that are true.

In contrast, Bush and Cheney played the politics of fear by saying things that weren't true. That's the difference.

The columnist Leonard Pitts, generally recognized as an independent and a centrist, wrote this in his February 1 column. Tragically, it sums up the matter well. Writing of a man named Doug who sent him an e-mail, Pitts wrote (the emphasis is mine):

"I bet that will surprise Doug. He seems to buy the notion, propounded by the likes of Limbaugh and lapped up by millions of Dougs and Dougettes, that one's first loyalty as an American is to party or ideology. So that you must defend your guy with mindless zeal even if he is President God-awful and attack the other guy with mindless zeal even if he is so new to the office his business cards haven't yet come back from the printer. Mindless zeal is the common denominator. What's right, what's wrong, what's best for the country, these things don't even enter the equation.

"Yes, we all have our politics, our prisms, our pet narratives. Nothing wrong with that, nothing wrong with embracing an ideology that gives structure and order to your thinking. But for too many of us, ideology becomes identity, becomes an intellectual straitjacket, becomes an excuse not to think. Instead, they wallow in a lazy childishness such that questions involving the life and future of a great nation are treated like stickball or tag, games played with the mindless zeal of childhood, as if nothing of substance were at stake, and victory were its own reward.

"That's what you hear in Doug's e-mail, an echo of childish voices chanting "nyah nyah nyah." "You ravage Bush we ravage Obama." Then what? You ravage the next guy and we ravage the guy after that? We don't even know who those guys — or women — are yet."

I'm sorry to say that this is what the Republican party has become.

[Guest Paul]

You left out two things, Republicans eat Democratic babies and rape their women.

No, but they do take their money while their babies go without medical care or an adequate education.

You're a perfect illustration of Leonard Pitts' editorial: "they wallow in a lazy childishness such that questions involving the life and future of a great nation are treated like stickball or tag." It's a pity. I believe that deep down you really do care about our country. But tragically, you have become so radical in your ideology that you're literally blind to reality. As a result, all you do is behave like a jerk, when you could make a valuable contribution to this forum. If you ever decide that you want to have a positive influence here, or anywhere:

1. You must take responsibility for what you write. That means that when someone points out an error, you have an obligation to acknowledge it and adjust your views accordingly. I would think a self-described conservative would understand responsibility, but sadly that appears not to be true in your case.

2. You must stop posting things that aren't true. When I say "you must," I'm not suggesting that I can force you; I'm just making the point that you can't add anything of value to this forum by posting things that aren't true. It doesn't serve this forum, our community, our state, our country or you personally.

3. You must recognize that government's inefficiencies do not end the analysis. In the 1950s the United States built an interstate highway system, coordinated and largely funded by the federal government. No doubt there was waste and inefficiency. Was it 5%, 20%, 50%, 100%? Did the program cost 5% more than it should have or 100% more than it should have, or somewhere in between? I don't know, but the end result was a system of highways that completely transformed our economy, for the better. Even with all the waste, it was a bargain. That's not to say that we should accept waste and inefficiency; every effort should be made to eliminate them. But if we don't understand the role of government in the modern economy, we're in for big trouble. In fact, that's exactly why we're in this trouble right now. Reagan told us government was the problem, and Republican politicians took it to an extreme. But you guys on the right are kicking and screaming like the spoiled child in the family who has to be appeased for the family to have any peace; we can't afford appeasing you this time.

Today we are facing a similar situation with energy development as we faced with highways in the 1950s. You can't make sense out of these issues if you refuse to think about them.

[Guest Guest]

Today Obama turned loose the Cole bomber, a terrorist who admitted his involvement in the bombing of a US ship that killed 17 sailors. The families of those murdered sailors are in disbelief that Obama ordered him turned loose.

Obama has done more harm to our military's morale in his first three weeks in office than Clinton ever did, no small feat.

We know that Obama has Muslim relatives, I'm wondering if the bomber was a cousin.

I'm wondering if your head ever leaves your A**?

[Guest Guest]

You're missing out on a golden opportunity here, Patriot. You could demonstrate some real decency and character by issuing a retraction and an earnest apology for your incendiary lie, and show that you are not the gutless, lying piece of garbage that you appear to be.

But he IS the gutless, lying piece of garbage that he appears to be.

[Guest Patriot]

But he IS the gutless, lying piece of garbage that he appears to be.

Don't hold back, tell me what you really think.

[Bern]

What makes it possible is that most Americans who don't agree with them don't understand it either. They think that the leadership of an entire political party can't be that despicable, so the critics must be the radicals.

I hope the American people figure this out soon.

Citizens of a country rarely recognize when their leaders, are bad, rotten, despicable or simply evil. Its the "my country is blessed and this can never happen here" syndrome. Which is a great comfort and help to rotten leaders who are blindly supported and given the benefit of the doubt.

We've seen it in Germany where good Germans upset over Brownshirt antics would say "if only the Fuhrer knew" or in Russia where Russians said "if only Uncle Joe knew". Their knew and approved.

[Guest Guest]

Don't hold back, tell me what you really think.

I think YOU are a gutless, lying, REMF!

[Guest Patriot]

I think YOU are a gutless, lying, REMF!

It's amazing how brave some punks can be on a keyboard.

[Guest Guest]

It's amazing how brave some punks can be on a keyboard.

Funny, every time i see one of YOUR posts I'm amazed at just how stupid YOU can be in life.

And when it comes to bravery I hardly think you exhinited any hiding under your desk in a rear area.

[Guest Guest]

It's amazing how brave some punks can be on a keyboard.

Indeed. And how dishonest. The Cole bomber has not been turned loose. You were lying. That's a fact.