America: Freedom to Fascism

[Guest Keith-Marshall,Mo]

I would like to hear from anyone who has seen this documentary called America: Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo.

Those who havn't seen really need to take the time to rent is and watch it with an open mind.

I believe that it cuts to the core of how and why our govt. operates the way it does.

Not only will you be outraged but, like me you will realize how futile and stupid we are to argue amongst oursleves while we are ingorant to what is really happening.

This film has no particualr partisan slant, it simply sheds light on a few dirty little secrets about our govt. Although the Bush and Clinton adminstrations are mentioned they are not dwelled upon. This stuff has been going on for almost a 100 years. If there is anyone out there who has seen it and can defend the govt's actions, I would like to know how and why.

This is about how we the people work for the govt' and the gov't is run by private entities. How we are frightend and intimdated by the likes of the IRS ans prosectued for breaking laws that DON"T even exist.

I would really like to see paticpation by all of us on this board. I think we should talk about it and try to find a way to fix it. We, all of us are getting screwed and the only way it can be stopped is to bring the subject into the light of day.

[Strife767]

(extraneous post edited out)

[Guest Patriot]

I would like to hear from anyone who has seen this documentary called America: Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo.

Those who havn't seen really need to take the time to rent is and watch it with an open mind.

  I believe that it cuts to the core of how and why our govt. operates the way it does.

  Not only will you be outraged but, like me you will realize how futile and stupid we are to argue amongst oursleves while we are ingorant to what is really happening.

  This film has no particualr partisan slant, it simply sheds light on a few dirty little secrets about our govt. Although the Bush and Clinton adminstrations are mentioned they are not dwelled upon. This stuff has been going on for almost a 100 years. If there is anyone out there who has seen it and can defend the govt's actions, I would like to know how and why.

  This is about how we the people work for the govt' and the gov't is run by private entities. How we are frightend and intimdated by the likes of the IRS ans prosectued for breaking laws that DON"T even exist.

I would really like to see paticpation by all of us on this board. I think we should talk about it and try to find a way to fix it. We, all of us are getting screwed and the only way it can be stopped is to bring the subject into the light of day.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can solve your paranoia. Move to Mexico.

[Guest Guest]

I can solve your paranoia.  Move to Mexico.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"Patriot"

I expected nothing less from you. Id' rather be paranoid than oblivious.

Have you watched it? If you haven't then I would ask that you withold any comment. I had hoped that this thread would be for those who have seen it and would like to add some educated comments.

If you have watched it and can still support the gov't in thier actions then I suggest that you don't even know the definition of the word "patriot".

Again, this is not about wheter one is a republican or democrat, it's about the gov't as a whole.

If you can watch this documentary without being outraged and not wanting to do anything about it then you are complicit in the illegalities of our gov't. and you sir/madam are a disgrace to our constititution, our soldiers, our flag and our citizens.

I dare you to watch it and then comment on something that actually pertains to the documentary. Please dear "Patriot", please show all of us who have endured your childish and ignorant comments that you have the capactity to actually educate yourself on a subject before commenting on it. One of the most infuriating things about you is that you are too ingnorant to realize that I am looking out for you as well.

Trust me, the gov't. loves folks like you who question nothing.

Fact is patriot, I love this country more than you can fathom and will seek out the truth wherever it may be. I challange you to do the same. Can you pull yourself away from FOX news long enough to even look at other viewpoints before you form an opinion? Ditto for 2smart before he/she graces this thread with one of thier pearls of wisdom.

" Our country deserves our support at all time and our government only when it deserves it"

-Mark Twain

"Voters decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything."

-Stalin

[Strife767]

I can solve your paranoia.  Move to Mexico.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What a disgrace coming from someone who imagines himself a "patriot."

Patriotism means wanting what's best for your country, and the original poster clearly fits that description. You, on the other hand, tarnish the word just by attaching it to yourself. You'd have to attach it to yourself, because surely no one else in their right mind would attach it to you. Disgustingly presumptuous.

[Strife767]

Actually, no one who wants to see it has to rent it if they have broadband--the full movie can be found on Google Video:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1...duration%3Along

Just passing that along.

Also--still in the process of watching it, but already I've seen a few things (like misquotes including one that took Clinton out of context when he was talking about gun rights and made it look like he was talking about rights in general) that have made this a very "grain of salt" movie for me already...considering this blatant error is less than 15 minutes in, I'm really going to have a hard time taking other stuff in here at face value.

EDIT: The tax protesters' arguments don't seem to hold water. The following source argued (quite compellingly, too, if I do say so myself) against every claim I saw in the documentary:

http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Per...s/IncomeTax.htm

[Guest a proud american]

I would like to hear from anyone who has seen this documentary called America: Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo.

Those who havn't seen really need to take the time to rent is and watch it with an open mind.

  I believe that it cuts to the core of how and why our govt. operates the way it does.

  Not only will you be outraged but, like me you will realize how futile and stupid we are to argue amongst oursleves while we are ingorant to what is really happening.

  This film has no particualr partisan slant, it simply sheds light on a few dirty little secrets about our govt. Although the Bush and Clinton adminstrations are mentioned they are not dwelled upon. This stuff has been going on for almost a 100 years. If there is anyone out there who has seen it and can defend the govt's actions, I would like to know how and why.

  This is about how we the people work for the govt' and the gov't is run by private entities. How we are frightend and intimdated by the likes of the IRS ans prosectued for breaking laws that DON"T even exist.

I would really like to see paticpation by all of us on this board. I think we should talk about it and try to find a way to fix it. We, all of us are getting screwed and the only way it can be stopped is to bring the subject into the light of day.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Where can we get a copy?

[Guest 2smart4u]

I would like to hear from anyone who has seen this documentary called America: Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo.

Those who havn't seen really need to take the time to rent is and watch it with an open mind.

  I believe that it cuts to the core of how and why our govt. operates the way it does.

  Not only will you be outraged but, like me you will realize how futile and stupid we are to argue amongst oursleves while we are ingorant to what is really happening.

  This film has no particualr partisan slant, it simply sheds light on a few dirty little secrets about our govt. Although the Bush and Clinton adminstrations are mentioned they are not dwelled upon. This stuff has been going on for almost a 100 years. If there is anyone out there who has seen it and can defend the govt's actions, I would like to know how and why.

  This is about how we the people work for the govt' and the gov't is run by private entities. How we are frightend and intimdated by the likes of the IRS ans prosectued for breaking laws that DON"T even exist.

I would really like to see paticpation by all of us on this board. I think we should talk about it and try to find a way to fix it. We, all of us are getting screwed and the only way it can be stopped is to bring the subject into the light of day.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, Keith, I watched this rediculous video. It is one of the most ignorant, moronic pieces of trash I've ever watched. If you believe one minute of this video then you must be freakin' retarded.

[Guest Keith-Marshall,mo]

Actually, no one who wants to see it has to rent it if they have broadband--the full movie can be found on Google Video:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1...duration%3Along

Just passing that along.

Also--still in the process of watching it, but already I've seen a few things (like misquotes including one that took Clinton out of context when he was talking about gun rights and made it look like he was talking about rights in general) that have made this a very "grain of salt" movie for me already...considering this blatant error is less than 15 minutes in, I'm really going to have a hard time taking other stuff in here at face value.

EDIT: The tax protesters' arguments don't seem to hold water. The following source argued (quite compellingly, too, if I do say so myself) against every claim I saw in the documentary:

http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Per...s/IncomeTax.htm

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for the link, Strife. Have you had a chance to watch it?

BTW that's my post above as guest because I forgot to sign in.

[Guest Keith,Marshall,MO]

Well, Keith, I watched this rediculous video. It is one of the most ignorant, moronic pieces of trash I've ever watched.  If you believe one minute of this video then you must be freakin' retarded.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Really? Can't you be more specific? For instance how long was the documentary?

[Strife767]

Where can we get a copy?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you're not on dial-up: http://forums.kearnyontheweb.com/index.php...indpost&p=59141

[Strife767]

Thanks for the link, Strife. Have you had a chance to watch it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, and I've got to say--the few legitimate points it makes seem to drown in the conspiracy theories and wild stuff in the latter portions of it. None of the former really seemed like new information (but maybe that's just me)...I already knew the Patriot Act was BS etc.

*chuckles* After realizing that this film is on Rotten Tomatoes, it appears that my reaction to it was not in any way unique: http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/america_fr...dom_to_fascism/

[Guest BushBacker]

Thanks for the link, Strife. Have you had a chance to watch it?

BTW that's my post above as guest because I forgot to sign in.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I watched the video; idiotic.

If we didn't pay taxes, how would we pay for all the defeatocratic giveaway programs ?? And if Hilliary gets elected taxes are going up again. Free college tuition for illegal aliens, open borders, free health care, etc.

[Stixx3969]

Actually, no one who wants to see it has to rent it if they have broadband--the full movie can be found on Google Video:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1...duration%3Along

Just passing that along.

Also--still in the process of watching it, but already I've seen a few things (like misquotes including one that took Clinton out of context when he was talking about gun rights and made it look like he was talking about rights in general) that have made this a very "grain of salt" movie for me already...considering this blatant error is less than 15 minutes in, I'm really going to have a hard time taking other stuff in here at face value.

EDIT: The tax protesters' arguments don't seem to hold water. The following source argued (quite compellingly, too, if I do say so myself) against every claim I saw in the documentary:

http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Per...s/IncomeTax.htm

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You are quite right to take it with a grain of salt, but then, every bit of info we get about the govt. no matter the source should be taken with a grain of salt. I watched the video, I am the orginal poster. If only a fraction of the video is true then it is still reason enough for outrage. That is my point.

[Guest Patriot]

Well, Keith, I watched this rediculous video. It is one of the most ignorant, moronic pieces of trash I've ever watched.  If you believe one minute of this video then you must be freakin' retarded.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I watched it too. A perfect example of the radical left mentality; "Blame America First".

[Guest Guest]

I watched the video; idiotic.

  If we didn't pay taxes, how would we pay for all the defeatocratic giveaway programs ??  And if Hilliary gets elected taxes are going up again. Free college tuition for illegal aliens, open borders, free health care, etc.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If we didn't pay taxes who would finance The Shrub's war of choice?

[Guest Keith-Marshall,MO]

I watched it too.  A perfect example of the radical left mentality; "Blame America First".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ok Patriot and 2smart. You say you have watched it. Give me one specific element from the documentary. Neither of you have done that yet.

[Guest Paul]

"Patriot"

I expected nothing less from you.  Id' rather be paranoid than oblivious.

Have you watched it? If you haven't then I would ask that you withold any comment. I had hoped that this thread would be for those who have seen it and would like to add some educated comments.

If you have watched it and can still support the gov't in thier actions then I suggest that you don't even know the definition of the word "patriot".

  Again, this is not about wheter one is a republican or democrat, it's about  the gov't as a whole.

  If you can watch this documentary without being outraged and not wanting to do anything about it then you are complicit in the illegalities of our gov't. and you sir/madam are a disgrace to our constititution, our soldiers, our flag and our citizens.

    I dare you to watch it and then comment on something that actually pertains to the documentary. Please dear "Patriot", please show all of us who have endured your childish and ignorant comments that you have the capactity to actually educate yourself on a subject before commenting on it. One of the most infuriating things about you is that you are too ingnorant to realize that I am looking out for you as well.

  Trust me, the gov't. loves folks like you who question nothing.

Fact is patriot, I love this country more than you can fathom and will seek out the truth wherever it may be. I challange you to do the same. Can you pull yourself away from FOX news long enough to even look at other viewpoints before you form an opinion? Ditto for 2smart before he/she graces this thread with one of thier pearls of wisdom.

" Our country deserves our support at all time and our government only when it deserves it"

          -Mark Twain

"Voters decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything."

                                                                                -Stalin

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have not yet seen the film, which is why I have not yet commented on this topic. If I can view it online I may do that today or tomorrow.

This comment is to support the one above. Ours is a great country, but we are nowhere near the greatness we could have achieved had we actually lived out our nation's founding principles. Great nations set an example for their people and for the world. As with an individual, doing what is right is a narrower and harder path than the alternatives, but true greatness is achieved on that path and none other. Had we done that, our nation could by now have solved some of the problems that will plague the next generations, and we would not be facing the division of the kind expressed in so-called "Patriot's" inane remarks.

[Guest Paul]

I would like to hear from anyone who has seen this documentary called America: Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo.

Those who havn't seen really need to take the time to rent is and watch it with an open mind.

  I believe that it cuts to the core of how and why our govt. operates the way it does.

  Not only will you be outraged but, like me you will realize how futile and stupid we are to argue amongst oursleves while we are ingorant to what is really happening.

  This film has no particualr partisan slant, it simply sheds light on a few dirty little secrets about our govt. Although the Bush and Clinton adminstrations are mentioned they are not dwelled upon. This stuff has been going on for almost a 100 years. If there is anyone out there who has seen it and can defend the govt's actions, I would like to know how and why.

  This is about how we the people work for the govt' and the gov't is run by private entities. How we are frightend and intimdated by the likes of the IRS ans prosectued for breaking laws that DON"T even exist.

I would really like to see paticpation by all of us on this board. I think we should talk about it and try to find a way to fix it. We, all of us are getting screwed and the only way it can be stopped is to bring the subject into the light of day.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I began watching this film and am not impressed. This is not a documentary, but ideological screed. The narrator makes unsubstantiated comments. We are asked, for example, to accept as fact that the 16th amendment was never properly ratified.

While I share the filmmaker’s concern about concentrated wealth and political power, concentrated wealth is an inevitable byproduct of technological advance. There is no way to maintain a nation of 300 million people with this sophisticated a network of economics, transportation, communications, etc., without taxation and significant government control. Forget about social programs, we couldn’t even maintain our military without taxes, and without government regulation of the economy it would collapse as it did in 1929.

I studied the federal tax code in law school, and as the film acknowledges the 16th amendment is commonly held to have been ratified. There is a sufficient basis in law for the income tax. I only watched a few minutes of the film, as the first few minutes gave me no confidence that it merited my time.

That said, the actions of the current administration, and of their supporters on the right who will be around after this administration leaves office, give us great cause for concern. Concentrated wealth must also be checked for the same reasons in my view.

[stp2007]

It's been oddly cold the last few days. Now I know why. Hell has frozen over. It seems 2smart4u, Strife767, BushBacker, Patriot and Paul actually kind of agree on something. Happy independence day to my southern neighbors. You should get together for a beer tomorrow. If you need a new topic to discuss I suggest Scooter Libby and todays news. That should be fun.

Well, Keith, I watched this rediculous video. It is one of the most ignorant, moronic pieces of trash I've ever watched.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, and I've got to say--the few legitimate points it makes seem to drown in the conspiracy theories and wild stuff in the latter portions of it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I watched the video; idiotic.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I watched it too.  A perfect example of the radical left mentality; "Blame America First".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I began watching this film and am not impressed.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Guest 2smart4u]

It's been oddly cold the last few days. Now I know why. Hell has frozen over. It seems 2smart4u, Strife767, BushBacker, Patriot and Paul actually kind of agree on something. Happy independence day to my southern neighbors. You should get together for a beer tomorrow. If you need a new topic to discuss I suggest Scooter Libby and todays news. That should be fun.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Shocking isn't it !! Just goes to show that Strife and Paul do have lucid moments.

BTW..... I applaud Bush for commuting Libby's prison sentence. The man broke no laws and commited no crimes, nor did he "out" anyone. It was a mean-spirited attempt by the defeatocrats to hurt Bush by putting Libby in jail.

[Guest Paul]

It's been oddly cold the last few days. Now I know why. Hell has frozen over. It seems 2smart4u, Strife767, BushBacker, Patriot and Paul actually kind of agree on something. Happy independence day to my southern neighbors. You should get together for a beer tomorrow. If you need a new topic to discuss I suggest Scooter Libby and todays news. That should be fun.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Notice, however, that BushWhacker and PackRat used the film as a launching point for yet another predictable attack on the left. (2smart probably forgot.) In attacking the income tax, the film actually makes a point usually made on the right, though there have been lefties to come 'round the barn making the same point. I wouldn't give BushWhacker, PackRat or 2dim4words so much credit as to think that they actually know why the film is as bad as it seems to be --- judging from the first three minutes or so, which is as far as I thought it necessary to go.

Sorry, Keith, but this one is a stinker. That doesn't mean that you don't have a valid point about the threat of fascism in America. Maybe we could start that discussion over with a more credible source as a starting point.

[Guest Guest]

Shocking isn't it !!  Just goes to show that Strife and Paul do have lucid moments.

  BTW..... I applaud Bush for commuting Libby's prison sentence. The man broke no laws and commited no crimes, nor did he "out" anyone. It was a mean-spirited attempt by the defeatocrats to hurt Bush by putting Libby in jail.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

On the contrary, Libby took the fall for an entire White House full of liars. That is why Bush made sure he didn't serve any prison time --- what a great way to buy his silence, and of course Republican lackeys will pay his $250,000 fine. So he gets probation for helping the worst administration in history cover the fact that it lied us into a war. Far from not committing any crime, he committed one of the greatest crimes in American history and with the help of a president who has no scruples, he will essentially get away with it.

[Guest BushBacker]

Shocking isn't it !!  Just goes to show that Strife and Paul do have lucid moments.

  BTW..... I applaud Bush for commuting Libby's prison sentence. The man broke no laws and commited no crimes, nor did he "out" anyone. It was a mean-spirited attempt by the defeatocrats to hurt Bush by putting Libby in jail.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Absolutely right. All Libby is "guilty" of is lying. Sort of like another lie I remember, "I did not have sexual relations with that woman". (For that lie, the rapist is now the darling of the defeatocratic party, go figure).

[Stixx3969]

Absolutely right.  All Libby is "guilty" of is lying. Sort of like another lie I remember, "I did not have sexual relations with that woman". (For that lie, the rapist is now the darling of the defeatocratic party, go figure).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No one is defending the Clinton admistration, but it seems that Bush apologists blame everything on the them. That doesn't make the actions of this administration right and it's the most childish response I can imagine.

No one said what Clinton did was right. "Clinton did it so why can't we"?

If that's the way you feel maybe you should go back to the playground and let the grown-ups talk.

The point is, at that level of government it's all bullshit. Republican or Democrat it doesn't matter who is in charge which is the point I was trying to make when I wrote the thread.

BTW, did you even watch the documentary? I doesn't matter wheter you liked it or agreed with it, but it would have been nice to see some "educated" commentary on this thread.

For all of your support for GW, do you really think that he loses a minute of sleep over you the citizen? Did Clinton? Bush Sr.?

This government is broken no matter who is in charge and you should be ashamed of yourself for wearing blinders simply because your guy won. I use the term "won" very loosely.

We need campaign finance reform and we need it now.